[Primer] Boros Burn

BrainsickHater · Postby **BrainsickHater** » Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:28 pm

What's the thinking behind the 3rd Chandra?

Purp · Postby **Purp** » Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:34 pm

What's the thinking behind the 3rd Chandra?

They only have 4 dspheres!

Khaospawn · Postby **Khaospawn** » Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:46 pm

What's the thinking behind the 3rd Chandra?
They only have 4 dspheres!

Elricity · Postby **Elricity** » Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:48 pm

And do you guys typically try to Burn out or ignore early Jaces? Does it depend on if you have a creature or not? Because even when I have Phoenix beats, I typically accept that it's a 1/2 and keep burning their face. I guess if I start burning out early Jaces, I could start bringing in Flamespeakers.

If you're able to go one drops successfully against control, you might be able to squeeze out ignoring Jace before he ultimates. However, if you get to the point where you realize you can't, you're now stuck spending multiple cards dealing with him when it could have generally been one. I play a slower game against control so I have to remove Jace. I also don't like him building up to the point where he has the option of using multiple -2 if he
removes my creatures. YMMV.

Lightning_Dolt · Postby **Lightning_Dolt** » Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:55 pm

I laugh when I see someone type "Stroke the Flame".
Whoops I shall make the amendments

- - - - - - -

4-0'ed again taking down two fellow grinders in the process

This will be my last standard game for awhile - so if you have question ask them sooner rather then later.

Why?

xosesinho · Postby **xosesinho** » Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:38 pm

My name is Xose, I am from spain, my english is very poor, but I,m trying read all for this forum.
I want say that I play satyr firedancer in my sideboard. Whats is your opinnion???

Thanks a lot, your information is very important

Elricity · Postby **Elricity** » Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:57 pm

Very good against creature decks with low removal like blue devotion.

Very unreliable against high removal decks which is a lot of the format.

zemanjaski · Postby **zemanjaski** » Tue Jul 29, 2014 11:52 pm

Yeah I didn't like pillar of light sorry.

Purp · Postby **Purp** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:13 am

I ran a 2 of pillar, and it was great at killing things when I needed it to. However, killing a courser was only relevant in 1 game of the 4 matches I played against it. The casting cost did matter, because it stops you from doing 2 spells a turn. I would most likely do a split of 1 reprisal and 1 pillar of light, 2 reprisals is equally good, but the chance to killa courser/archangel can be relevant if you are expecting junk.

magicdownunder · Postby **magicdownunder** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:44 am

What's the thinking behind the 3rd Chandra?

She comes in when I'm playing the control role - casting cost doesn't really matter as much in those situations.

Vs the Mirror or Control... well they only have some many outs

Why?

I'm working on some projects which will consume my free time - once they're done or near completion I'll be back in standard on and off through out this grinding season (yeah... this will be a tough 35).

@[card]Pillar of Light[/
card]: I haven't had a game where I drew it and thought that it was better then Reprisal... but I know I'll eventual have a game where my opp. drops down either Angel of thune, Nylea, God of the Hunt, Whip of erebos or some annoying Sheep/Courser which will make the exile or toughness clause really relevant.

zemanjaski · Postby **zemanjaski** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 2:13 am

1/1 split makes sense to me.

/ stuff that Purp said.

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 2:23 am

Highlights for today's DE are posted. Step by step guide to beat Mono Green included. What NOT to do against Jund Walkers also included. I might finally be off Firedrinker Satyr. It only comes in against UW most of the time. Toil/Trouble may just be better.

sirzevo · Postby **sirzevo** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 6:32 am

Hey everyone. Long time lurker here. I just finished recording some videos of me playing burn. I've been playing the deck for a while... but you wouldn't know it from the videos.

Anyway, critique welcome. Would appreciate any feedback.

Match 1 Boros Burn vs. W/U Weenie.
Match 2 Boros Burn vs. Naya Tokens.
Match 3 Boros Burn vs. Orzhov Control.

magicdownunder · Postby **magicdownunder** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 9:18 am

@BlakLanner

What I like about your videos:

1) Clear voice
2) Music
3) Live audience

I don't really understand your approach (sequencing, decision making and boarding).

Things like:

[*]Boarding out Chandra's Phoenix vs Bx Devotion (Bx Devo is an attrition deck so cards like Chandra's Phoenix does lots of work)

[*]Killing creatures on the attack step rather then the declare attackers vs R (bloodlust is a thing) or using Chained to the Rocks vs Foundry Street Denizen when you have YP$ in play and your opp. has a 2/2 which you could target.

[*]Holding back with Chandra's Phoenix during a stall state vs G Devotion

Strike me as odd... that said I know that jarring feeling you get when you play Burn in eternal format and then jump into standard.... (also lost vaults in really super greedy gambles which costed me dearly).

@Sirzevo

Your list doesn'
t seem very optimal list for an T1 metagame, did you designed it for a local metagame (nothing wrong with meta tweaks)? I personal find it difficult to follow cockatrice so I can't really comment much on the games.

NotARobot · Postby **NotARobot** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:03 pm

Jumped in a standard daily yesterday and 3-1, was surprised to realize they are still paying out jbt. Are they switching to m15 pay outs anytime soon?

magicdownunder · Postby **magicdownunder** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:07 pm

Jumped in a standard daily yesterday and 3-1, was surprised to realize they are still paying out jbt. Are they switching to m15 pay outs anytime soon?

After this downtime it will be pure M15 (so 4-0 = 11 M15, 3-1 = 6 M15) here is the source.

P.S. I'm still working on the standard SB Guide, if you want the rough copy you can just PM me.

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 2:58 pm

Thanks for the critique, MDU.

I tend to be more afraid of Denizen than Cacklers. I also tend to play scared too often, it seems. Looking back at that game, it was definitely incorrect.

Casting after attackers is a habit I got from Legacy where I want to wait for them to commit before I use the removal. One would think that having used Ghor-Clan Rampagers myself for a season would have broken me of that habit but, well....

I tend to use my Phoenixes more defensively than most in such board states, having gotten into the habit of blocking and buying it back, fearing getting blown out by a Tactics or other multi-creature pump spell killing me in one shot.

I always agonize over the Phoenixes when fighting Black. When they are good, they are excellent but I don't often get to buy them back or they face off against Nightveil. I just want to bring in too many cards against them (Gryff, Revoker, sometimes Wear/Tear or
Chandra) and can't seem to bring myself to cut Boros Charms (that is part of the bad habits being a Legacy/Modern burn player gives me).

This is really showing me how much of a weaker player I have become by only playing at my LGS when most of the better players are staying home waiting for rotation due to being bored with the format. I am letting myself get sloppy and making bad decisions that are so blatantly obvious when watched on replay.

NotARobot · Postby **NotARobot** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:09 pm

I don't think you should ever cut phoenix vs black. It just provides too much utility, eats up their removal, is fantastic to hold down demon. And you'd be surprised how few people block with nvs when you swing in with a phoenix. Searing blood is a real card they're afraid of, and usually play around in my experience.

Rhyno · Postby **Rhyno** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:55 pm

So who else is going to be at the Syracuse Open?
I'm expecting the typical meta of Jund, Junk, MonoU, and MonoB with a spattering of Walker builds and an uptick of W/G aggro.
I'll be building accordingly, and probably ignoring the PT results.

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:56 pm

I will be there. Finances and time finally allow me to attend one of these. I would still recommend paying attention to the PT results. There are going to be plenty of people copying those decks.

Whole · Postby **Whole** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 9:46 pm

If you have two Chained to the Rocks on the draw vs UW control (game 1), would you consider scooping for a huge g2 advantage? (Assuming they play an early elixer or something so you 100% know they're on control)

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:42 pm

New highlights are up again. Note: This is the last time I will post that. I will try to stream once a day at least until Syracuse for testing.

Another 2-2 finish. I lost to Mono Blue and GW and can't help but wonder if I need more tech against those kinds of decks than just Firedancers. I am running the same 75 that I posted a few pages back.

Whole: I would not. While effectively a mulligan to 5, you may get valuable data like knowing if they are on DSphere or Planar Cleansing, Esper vs straight UW, etc.

NotARobot · Postby **NotARobot** » Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:51 pm

I mean theres always the chance they kept a shit hand, get screwed in one way or another, ect. I never scoop for that kind of reason.

sirzevo · Postby **sirzevo** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 3:13 am

@Sirzevo

Your list doesn't seem very optimal list for an T1 metagame, did you designed it for a local metagame (nothing wrong with meta tweaks)? I personal find it difficult to follow cockatrice so I can't really comment much on the games.

Thanks for checking out the videos. Yeah, I was trying to be a bit more control-y (just experimenting) and I was just trying a few ideas with some of the cards in my sideboard. Didn't work too well.

I plan on going to a TCGPlayer event coming to my area next month, so I need to get as much T1 practice in as I can. I really like Searing Blood. It's just been
too good and useful to me, so I will probably go with the 3/3/3 list.

Rhyno · Postby **Rhyno** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 3:30 am

I will be there. Finances and time finally allow me to attend one of these. I would still recommend paying attention to the PT results. There are going to be plenty of people copying those decks.

I don't expect the Open to shift so quickly that I'll need to make major changes.
There is one exception though, if G/W aggro does well I'll make some adjustments. I don't feel very favored in that matchup and I think a lot of people might audible to it if it does well.

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 3:45 am

Were it just a GP, I would agree. However, people will blindly follow PT results. Having said that, I don't expect any major shifts to come out of this PT. The decks I expect to be most prevalent are Mono Black, Mono Blue, Jund Walkers, UW Control, and GW Aggro with a random smattering of Mono Green. I am trying to tweak my deck to fight these.

I also feel a bit behind against Mono Blue and GW if I don't get the Chains exactly when I need it or land an early Firedancer that shuts them out of the game. Someone on my stream suggested Boros Reckoner to fight those decks. I don't know if I can support it when I run both YP and SFD which require higher amounts of spells but it is an option worth exploring.

This is my deck for reference:
[deck]Boros Burn[/deck]

I would like to find room for some more "big aggro" hate. It was suggested that I remove the Firedrinker Satyrs as they only come in against UW. They might be right.

magicdownunder · Postby **magicdownunder** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 3:52 am

Boros Reckoner is a beating vs GW but against Ux Devotion you run the risk of being blownout by domestication or being negated via thasa or fliers.

I would recommend running Banishing Light, and just cutting all the Satyr Firedancer for proper removal like Mortars (its better vs R decks as well).

I also don't think Phyrexian Revoker is what your after in a burn deck (its good in RDW or AiR) but in burn you don't have that many other creatures so the deck in which you so want Phyrexian Revoker in will just point removal at it.

Rhyno · Postby **Rhyno** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 4:08 am

I would like to find room for some more "big aggro" hate. It was suggested that I remove the Firedrinker Satyrs as they only come in against UW. They might be right.

I was running Firedrinker Satyrs too because I was looking for a 4-of to bring in against both Mono Black and Control, as I prefer to beat down against both of those decks. The card just isn't good after the first few turns though so I stopped.

I think 4 chains main and 2 BL in the board is correct, and that helps against both Master of Waves and big idiots.

This is the board I'm looking at right now

[deck]
3 Mizzium Mortars
3 Boros Reckoner
2 Wear//Tear
2 Banishing Light
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
2 Assemble the Legion
1 Hushwing Gryff
[/deck]

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 4:14 am

Maybe it is time to brush off an old favorite. New sideboard plan based on your suggestions:

[deck]
2 Wear // Tear
1 Chained to the Rocks
4 Satyr Firedancer
2 Banishing Light
2 Hushwing Gryff
2 Viashino Firstblade
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
[/deck]

BrainsickHater · Postby **BrainsickHater** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 5:38 am

I find myself really liking that Firstblade

BrainsickHater · Postby **BrainsickHater** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 5:43 am

Altho nonbo with Gryff in the MB matchup

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 1:15 pm

/facepalm. I missed that failed interaction. With only two of each, I should be ok, assuming I can find room to bring it in.

Whole · Postby **Whole** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 1:54 pm

Alright leaving for SCG Dallas tomorrow. Anyone has any tweaks for this list? (Especially sideboard) It's pretty standard, but I want to make sure I'm not missing anything obvious. I guess it's just last minute nerves.

conSeeDed · Postby **conSeeDed** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 1:59 pm

Hey, I know I'm new here (took a long break from magic and finally getting serious) but I've been catching up and want to run this deck in an IQ this weekend.
It looks like nobody is running Fated Conflagration any more. What is the gameplan if you run into Orzhov control?
Taking magicdownunder's SB (because he looks to have the most options vs Orzhov, but I could be mistaken), do you put in the Gryffs even though they run 4 LBZs? Otherwise, the only thing that I see working is the 2x Pillars/Reprisals.
Alternatively, do we just try and burn through it and keep a Mortar/Stoke for Baron?

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:08 pm

Generally we just burn through it and Mortars/Stoke the Baron. We can make it through one or two Obzedat triggers and still be ok if were were closing the game out at that point. Griff can be used to stop the trigger and Reprisal/Pillar can kill it for those who run them.

Purp · Postby **Purp** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:29 pm

Alright leaving for SCG Dallas tomorrow. Anyone has any tweaks for this list? (Especially sideboard) It's pretty standard, but I want to make sure I'm not missing anything obvious. I guess it's just last minute nerves.

Id cut the stoke the flame for mortars. GW and Mono U will be on the rise, you will be much happier seeing mortars G1, than you will be scrying Stoke to the bottom.

I'd move the BL to the SB and the Chain back to MD. In G1, chain deals with problem creatures to allow you finish your race. Banishing Light deals with cards that you don't really care about G1 anyway.

Id cut 1 toil for either a 2nd reprisal (or 1
pillar of light), or for the 3rd flamespeaker. Flamespeaker is the literal nuts in the burn mirror, which you can expect to face. [You will face more decks with 4/4+ or mono U/mirror than you will Control.]

There is absolutely no reason to run a guildgate, make it a temple of malice (especially since you have toil), 3rd forge, or 4th mutavault.

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:47 pm

I can't help but wonder if I really need any dedicated anti-UW cards in my board at all. Maybe cut the Firstblades for Flamespeakers or Reprisals. Given how rarely I have been seeing it, Chandra, Banishing Light, and Wear/Tear might simply be enough.

Purp · Postby **Purp** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:50 pm

I don't think you need them, but I think it is important to understand how MUCH harder that matchup is without 1 drops or toils. Chandra, BL and Wear CAN be enough, but as a pilot, you have to play a whole lot differently. Lucky for you Blak, you have SCG Dallas and PT this weekend, so you can expect shifts from that.

NotARobot · Postby **NotARobot** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:52 pm

Alright leaving for SCG Dallas tomorrow. Anyone has any tweaks for this list? (Especially sideboard) It's pretty standard, but I want to make sure I'm not missing anything obvious. I guess it's just last minute nerves.

I would cut the guildgate for a scryland or a forge, and I prefer the 4th chain main, 2bl in sideboard, but it definitely looks solid! Good luck this weekend!

BlakLanner · Postby **BlakLanner** » Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:53 pm

I am fortunate to have one more week to prepare. I am already heavier on the top end than most of you guys so it just might be enough. If I actually ran into any UWx during testing I would know for sure, but it has been very scarce.

Dies to Removal

[Primer] Boros Burn

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