[Primer] RDW

[Valdarith]

I'm thinking that Thunderous Might may be a better option than Dragon Mantle now. All Dragon Mantle seems to do for me is draw a card as I've rarely used it for firebreathing. Thunderous Might on the other hand is like Madcap Skills 5-8 except even better on turn two if chained off an Emissary.

[Tyrael]

If you're playing Thunderous Might then boarding in a few copies of Legion Loyalist seems like a good option to me

[Longtoe]

Is anyone even trying out the RDW lists from sandydogmtg and the like? The aggro devotion lists? I like them a lot, however if there is an influx of mono U due to the last open, I will be wary of playing it. I hope the invitational this weekend has them do very poorly so they go off the radar for GP chicago.

[Tyrael]

Playing Tom Ross' new list atm


[deck]Boss Sligh[/deck]

its a ton of fun

[Tyrael]

RDW just won the SCG open in Columbus, the md numbers dont match up though

[deck=Mono Red Aggro; Festus Resendez; 1st Place at StarCityGames.com Standard Open on 6/14/2014]
Creatures (31)
4 Ash Zealot
4 Boros Reckoner
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Chandra's Phoenix
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Firedrinker Satyr
3 Firefist Striker
4 Rakdos Cackler

Lands (21)
19 Mountain
2 Mutavault

Spells (9)
4 Lightning Strike
2 Magma Jet
1 Searing Blood
2 Shock

Sideboard
3 Searing Blood
4 Skullcrack
2 Harness by Force
4 Mizzium Mortars
2 Toil[/deck]

[Deht]

Playing Tom Ross' new list atm


[deck]Boss Sligh[/deck]

its a ton of fun

He is completely steam rolling EVERYONE he plays in Standard at the SCG Invitational. His semi-finals game against a Jund Monsters opponent was 3-0 and done in under 20 minutes with sideboarding / shuffling

[Tyrael]

He just won the Invitational

he lost a single match in the finals

[LP, of the Fires]

Mono-Blue isn't as bad for red as you would think.

Fanatic of Mogis does a great job of closing games, and between makka's and/or well placed removal, you can come up with interesting lines to push damage through.

[LaZerBurn]

I've been running this on MTGO - Ari Lax did a piece on it on SCG Premium here. It's great fun to play and surprisingly robust

I personally prefer it to Tom Ross's Boss Sligh list but his obviously has legs given that he just stomped all over the Invitational

[deck=RDW; Gino Bautista; 2nd Place at StarCityGames.com Standard Open on 6/7/2014]
Creatures (32)
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Firefist Striker
4 Eidolon Of The Great Revel
4 Boros Reckoner
4 Chandra's Phoenix
4 Fanatic of Mogis

Lands (22)
19 Mountain
3 Mutavault

Spells (6)
4 Lightning Strike
2 Searing Blood

Sideboard (15)
n2 Searing Blood
2 Hammer Of Purphoros
4 Skullcrack
4 Mizzium Mortars
3 Burning Earth[/deck]

[LP, of the Fires]

I've played this deck and it's quite excellent. I think I like it more then the list that won this week(for being just 60 cards if nothing else).

The main places to screw around with numbers are whether or not you play mutavaults or magma jets and is harness by force where you want to be.

Solid overall if for nothing else then being very fun to play.

[Aodh]

Solid RDW list, IMO; a few considerations:

Eidolon > Ash Zealot here? I don't think so; stonewalling opposing aggro decks and being good in combat engagement alongside burn seems better here.
Mutavault > Mountain here? Not with 8 RR on 2 and 4 RRR on 3.
Is Chandra's Phoenix any good with 6 burn spells? Maybe two more one-drops, more BTE-fodder, or Hammer of Purphoros would be better.

[LaZerBurn]

I've played this deck and it's quite excellent. I think I like it more then the list that won this week(for being just 60 cards if nothing else).

The main places to screw around with numbers are whether or not you play mutavaults or magma jets and is harness by force where you want to be.

Solid overall if for nothing else then being very fun to play.

Totally agree it's very fun to play LP

Mutavaults yes, Magma Jet no for me - I've found the Vaults really good and despite having playing Jets in every list I've run since the came in I've not missed them.

Harness by Force might be worth a look; I the idea of Burning Earth but it's been a bit underwhelming so far.

[
quote="Aodh"]Solid RDW list, IMO; a few considerations:
Eidolon > Ash Zealot here? I don't think so; stonewalling opposing aggro decks and being good in combat engagement alongside burn seems better here.
Mutavault > Mountain here? Not with 8 RR on 2 and 4 RRR on 3.
Is Chandra's Phoenix any good with 6 burn spells? Maybe two more one-drops, more BTE-fodder, or Hammer of Purphoros would be better.[/quote]
I Ash Zealot but I've found Eidolon to be incredibly good in this list. As it stands I'm happy with my Pillar on legs

I thought the same about CP but having played the list I think it's worth running for the evasion alone.

19R is fine for RR and RRR IMHO. I understand that official FoS policy is 19R for Reckoner on curve

[Valdarith]

It's actually 20-21 red for RRR on curve.

[LP, of the Fires]

Val is Correct, but the counter argument is that having mutavault in your deck more then makes up for the inconsistencies. At the start of the format(and even in the previous one for me) me and Z where going as low as 18 mountains with 4 mutavault.

@Lazer: I agree on all points. I'm thinking of adding some combination of harness by force and Chandra to the board. Chandra might be terrible, but cards are cards and harness fits the creature dense stratagem. I could also see having flamespeakers in the board.

[Valdarith]

Val is Correct, but the counter argument is that having mutavault in your deck more then makes up for the inconsistencies. At the start of the format(and even in the previous one for me) me and Z where going as low as 18 mountains with 4 mutavault.

Yep. I think that's the main reason Reckoner fell out of favor in red lists (besides Rx Devotion). Playing Mutavault is just so much more powerful than playing a 3/3 for 3 in a format that doesn't care about text boxes.

[Aodh]

I think that the mana is good enough that the only reason to run a 1-color deck is for consistency reasons. That said, 19 sources might suffice for RR, but I think we should have 1RR on 3 for sure. Reckoner isn't powerful enough to strain the mana.

[LP, of the Fires]

Reckoner is good against everything but b black decks and he's usually fine against them in low curve aggro because your overloading their removal and he's basically unblockable.

It's the best card in your deck against any small creature deck.

[LaZerBurn]

Val is Correct, but the counter argument is that having mutavault in your deck more then makes up for the inconsistencies. At the start of the format(and even in the previous one for me) me and Z where going as low as 18 mountains with 4 mutavault.

@Lazer: I agree on all points. I'm thinking of adding some combination of harness by force and Chandra to the board. Chandra might be terrible, but cards are cards and harness fits the creature dense stratagem. I could also see having flamespeakers in the board.

Agreed Val is 100% Correct here Cheers Val ! My FoS 19R policy comment
was based on those 18 Mountain 4 Vault lists where if memory serves 19R was considered being on the safe side

Flamespeakers sounds interesting; with Zem praising them in Shota's Burn list and you mentioning them here I'm going to have to give in and actually test these I think

[Aodh]

Reckoner is good against everything but b black decks and he's usually fine against them in low curve aggro because your overloading their removal and he's basically unblockable.

It's the best card in your deck against any small creature deck.

I'm confused. The top 5 decks are: MBD, Esper, Jund Monsters, Burn, and MUD. In each of these match-ups Reckoner seems bad, bad, decent preboard/bad after, decent, and decent preboard/bad after.

I may be way off since I mostly just theorycraft, but Reckoner seems off.

More to come.

[LP, of the Fires]

Edit: Thought I was in the Nkythos red boards

I guess I'll just leave these comments in spoiler tags and right about reckoners strengths/shortcomings below all of this for RDW.

---

Reckoners fine vs. Black since basically everything DTR and you just need to spam permanents against them. Back in the day I'd board them out when I was on cacklers and drinkers in the board, but without that, you just play out your whole hand since you're absent sweepers and he's great at being able to attack into everything without trading with anything other then demon which is good.

Against the control decks, he's bad but that's a good matchup either way.

Vs. monsters, he's crucial for both being able to attack into everything and by providing 3 devotion of either color. My newest board plan involves
boarding out a land since I was losing by flooding vs. them, but I'm also bringing in Elspeth and it's come up several times where I've nykthos'd for 4 white between reckoner/chain to enable me to hit six mana for Big Speezy and her 3 rat ass kids.

The burn matchup is tough either way you slice it, but he's one of your better cards since he doesn't care about YP and is hard to deal with outside of enchantment removal.

Against Blue, he's better then you're other minions oddly because he's more expensive and therefore less likely to get tidebinder'd and again provides a whopping 3 devotion. Game one, you tend to win from 2/3 life by fanaticing them out for 8+ damage. In postboard games, you're trump is usually anger of the gods and reckoner can force them to overcommit if they have a flyer light draw and/or don't draw domestication. Attacking freely into master of waves is also a plus.

Vs. Black: Provides lots of devotion, attacks
into everything. All you're spells dtr so no biggie.

Vs. Blue: Way better then all your 1-drops which is a plus in and of itself and he can either attack into master of waves/nightveil spectors unlike the rest of your goons, or he halts all of their ground guys while you accrue devotion which is good for you either way.

Vs. Monsters: Fanatic is a hell of a card that's made better by reckoner and reckoner attacks through courser/caryatid while stonewalling there 4-drops when you need to slow it down and grind damage through with phoenix sword and shield style like Khaos used to advocate.

Vs. Control: yeah, he's real bad here, but at least he has 3 power!

Vs. Burn: This matchup is much closer then I thought it would be(seemed fairly unfavorable on paper and when I would test as the burn player vs. the gauntlet) but as the RDW player, I've found that the games go fairly long and being able to present lots of threats cheaply can pressure them fairly well into pointing burn at your dudes instead
of the face and reckoner LOVES being targeted by burn spells. The matchup can radically change on the play vs. the draw, but what usually happens is you get an early damage lead and if they don't have the chain for your reckoner, he either represents 3 damage a turn or he stonewalls Mutavaults/YP which you tend to be in the market for if ever you have to switch roles from beatdown to control.

[Purp]

How can reckoner attack into master of waves? am i missing something?

[LP, of the Fires]

It doesn't die to master, and you still get the damage trigger. If they try block with X other creatures other then frostburn weird, you either give it first strike and start murkin nigga's or you can let your reckoner take all the damage and get a fireball affect.

[Tyrael]

So guys, Eidolon or Zealot? Maybe a few Eidolons in the board?

[TheCleaner]

4-0'd (8-1) this to FNM Victory:
[deck]
3 Mutavault
18 Mountain
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Firedrinker Satyr
2 Foundry Street Denizen
4 Ash Zealot
4 Young Pyromancer
4 Chandras Phoenix
2 Chandra Pyromaster
4 Shock
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
2 Searing Blood
1 Madcap Skills

[/deck]

Sideboard:
[deck]
4 Skullcrack
2 Rakdos Shred Freak
2 Mizzium Mortars
1 Peak Eruption
1 Madcap Skills
1 Act of treason
2 Boros Reckoner
1 Pithing Needle
1 Flames of the Firebrand


[/deck]

Never used Reckoner or Flames. Madcap Skills were awesome against Naya and Jund.


My matchups:
MonoBlack
He mulled to 6 both matches. Had lots of OneDrops and played around BileBlight.

Naya
He was too slow and had to play Shocklands to get his Coursers out. Pyromancer and Foundry Street Denizen worked nicely.

UW Control
nHad 3 Mutavaults on board, Chandra and 2 Phoenixes in Hand but only 1 Mountain.
Game 2 he conceded due to Double Verdict and Double Jace and no land.
Game 3 was very close: He had that 5 Life Elixier, was on 3, but was short on Mana. I bluffed the Lethal burn (but only had a Shock) and my Chandra was at 7. He misplayed (forgot his Lightning Helix), and i won.

Jund
Won the dice roll, kept a onelander with Cackler Satyr Ash Zealot and Madcap Skills. Drew the Mountain!
Won my final game by stealing his Polukranos and Madcapping him!

[Tyrael]

[deck]RDW[/deck]

Kicked myself up to a 4-1 victory at the saturday tourney, beating B/U Mill, Dredge, Mono U devotion and Mono B devotion. Lost my match against Jund Monsters.

[LaZerBurn]

@ Tyrael - Well done! I missed your earlier post re Ash Vs Eidolon or I'd have said Eidolon How did it work out for you? I've found it amazing in this build (mine's only a few cards away from yours Post 929)

[Tyrael]

It is an absolute terror when you're on the play, I was never sad to draw it.

I also love the interaction between it and Firedrinker Satyr where you can safely pump your satyr because you know they will remove the eidolon instead anyway. It's good against so many decks (including other aggro decks, might I add) in the current format so I can say I'm extremely happy with it. I never missed Ash Zealot for even a second.

The eidolon also keeps people from removing your reckoners (which is super important vs Jund Monsters and the like) which were an all star for me yesterday.

[RaidaTheBlade]

Anybody wanna critique? It's a bit of an odd one, but I'm wanting to cash out of standard some, but my lgs is a bad environment for full-on boss sligh, and still not sure how I feel about the normal devotion build, so this is a tiny twist on it.


[deck]
Creatures (29)
4 Akroan Crusader
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Mogis's Warhound
2 Firefist Striker
4 Prophetic Flamespeaker
3 Rubblebelt Maaka

Lands (19)
17 Mountain
2 Mutavault

Spells (12)
4 Madcap Skills
3 Dragon Mantle
3 Titan's Strength
2 Blinding Flare



Sideboard (15)
2 Eidolon of the Great Revel
2 Lightning Strike
4 Skullcrack
2 Harness by Force
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Peak Eruption
[/deck]

[Valdarith]

Can't run Mutavaults with BTE in the deck. Need 18-19 red sources for him.

I've tried Flamespeaker in these lists but he slows the deck down a bit. He's lost me more games by slowing me than those he's won by just blowing my opponent out.

[TBuzzsaw]

So how well does the Sligh decks do against the decks that mainboard Golgari Charm? It's the only card I'm looking at that's seems to be a problem.

[Tyrael]

I haven't seen many people mb golgari charm yet but it's a huge blowout for sure

you can make the deck more resistant to it with more two-drops though (BTE and the like)

Here's an example of what Tom was running when Golgari Charm became more popular:

[deck] higher curve Sligh[/deck]

[TBuzzsaw]

I like the BTE list better in my meta since 1/3 of the decks have some combo of Golgari colors. I might give Sligh a try this week as a break from Hexproof now that everyone at my store is starting to sideboard against me.

[LP, of the Fires]

Just ignore the fact that charm is a card and take your ridiculously high game 1 percentage.

[Valdarith]

YOLO

[LP, of the Fires]

It's like affinity in modern, only you don't auto lose to the hate card.

[TBuzzsaw]

Trying this out for the week:

[deck]Creatures
4 Ash Zealot
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Foundry Street Denizen
3 Gore-House Chainwalker
4 Legion Loyalist
4 Rakdos Cackler
3 Rubblebelt Maaka

Spells
4 Madcap Skills
4 Lightning Strike
4 Titan's Strength

Lands
17 Mountain
1 Mutavault

Sideboard
4 Skullcrack
3 Eidolon of the Great Revel
3 Seismic Stomp
3 Searing Blood
2 Mizzium Mortars[/deck]


Current local meta: 45% B/G/x decks, 20% other G decks, 20% control, 15% other. Mono B is almost non-existent while Mono U shows up once in a while. BW Midrange, Burn/RDW, and White Weenie fill up the remaining spots.

[Valdarith]

17 red with BTE and Ash Zealot? Quite ambitious.

[TBuzzsaw]

I went 2-2 tonight, because I somehow mana flooded four games. In those four I went up to 7-9 lands against slow green decks. I even shuffled differently after the crazy draws only for it to repeat. The fourth time I was bewildered after mulling to 5 to find four lands in my hand, only to draw into three more in a row.

[Tyrael]

Seems like BTE is gonna be working overtime the coming months

You guys brewing yet?

[NerdBoyWonder]

Seems like BTE is gonna be working overtime the coming months

You guys brewing yet?

Creature wise this is what I am looking at. Frenzied Goblin may find a spot in Boss Sligh.