Dies to Removal

I'll update them as I can...as of right now, here's what we're looking at:

Advent of the Wurm 1GGW
Instant
Put a 5/5 green Wurm creature token with trample onto the battlefield.



Vorel of the Hull Clade 1GU
Legendary Creature - Human Merfolk
GU, Tap: For each counter on target artifact, creature, or land, put another of those counters on that permanent
1/4




I'm going to get these saved and hosted to a gallery pretty quick here, so I'll replace the text with images when I do.

Merfolk seems pretty unexciting, but I am sure there is application for that ability somewhere, but maybe not in standard right now.

Advent of the Wurm seems very powerful. Instant and Trample? The 5/5 for 4 was already seeing play in Type 2 and this is much better if you're in the colours. Probably not good enough to make Populate a thing though.

If this is all we're getting tonight...I am disappoint. I keep refreshing wizards.com, and I'm not getting anything new. Guess I'll have to check reddit to see if any other sources have come through.

They sometimes put things up in the image gallery without spoiling them more fully. Could be worth checking there.

That Wurm instant is one of the best cards I've seen in years. The Merfolk legend is EDH cool. Master of Cruelties is terrible on several levels.

Blah....that Orzhov card must have been resized on the page I saved it on. Gotta fix that.

Some interesting cards. I wonder if there is a combo you can build around Master of Cruelties?

Sin Collector obviously has some small applications in Aristocrats or BW Aggro; how good he is I don't know, but it is a 2-for-1 at least some of the time.

I'd play Master of Cruelties in draft...dunno about Constructed yet.

I can't see him being worthwhile in a straight BR Beatdown deck, because if he does connect, it makes all previous efforts irrelevant. Maybe something with Heartless Summoning? He doesn't need to physically do damage, and then anything else is a kill. He also makes lifegain mostly irrelevant. Hmmmmmm.

I am going to waste way too much time on what is obviously a terrible idea here.

Some interesting cards. I wonder if there is a combo you can build around Master of Cruelties?

I actually got thinking about him. I did a quick search...the only cards currently in Standard that have at least four power and first strike or double strike...thus, the only cards that can trade with him 1:1 are Carnival Hellsteed, Gisela, and Minotaur Aggressor. As far as I know, only ONE of those has seen even limited Constructed play. That means that this guy is going to be chewing through his opponents ranks unless they've got some neat tricks to pull, which are always possible. Indestructibility, for one...and Angelic Skirmisher could just be another one.

I really want to know if he can be comboed with. Pillar of Flame is obviously an easy finisher, but any burn spell will do. So that isn't necessarily a combo piece ~ any shell that incorporates removal will have a 'finisher'. So we need a way to:
1. find him
2. get him out in a timely and relevent fashion
3. get him to connect

Addressing these:
1. maybe a Grixis Shell? As a combo deck, access to blue probably isnt a bad idea anyway; counterspells and cards like forbidden alchemy are nice.
2. This I don't know. We can either look at a) mana accel (eg: keyrune) b) cost reduction (eg: heartless summoning) c) a haste enabler (so he hits a turn earlier)
3. Haste enabler? Removal? Something else?

Will be giving this some thought because I am a sicko.

Master of Cruelties + Hellrider on the board. If he's unblocked, they're dead.

I really want to know if he can be comboed with. Pillar of Flame is obviously an easy finisher, but any burn spell will do. So that isn't necessarily a combo piece ~ any shell that incorporates removal will have a 'finisher'. So we need a way to:
1. find him
2. get him out in a timely and relevent fashion
3. get him to connect

Addressing these:
1. maybe a Grixis Shell? As a combo deck, access to blue probably isnt a bad idea anyway; counterspells and cards like forbidden alchemy are nice.
2. This I don't know. We can either look at a) mana accel (eg: keyrune) b) cost reduction (eg: heartless summoning) c) a haste enabler (so he hits a turn earlier)
3. Haste enabler? Removal? Something else?

Will be giving this some thought because I am a
sicko.

If you want to talk Grixis...I can't believe I'm suggesting this, but...Teleportal?

noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

save yourselves the time!

the card is a dud!

Can't help myself. Bored at work. Must kill time.

fair enough!

I will spend zero time finding other bad cards to make master of cruelties playable.

Where is your sense of adventure?!

Okay I admit I spent all of Scars block trying to jam Mimic Vat into every deck possible.

I won a lot of money playing Heartless Havengul Combo, so would like to experience the same ridiculousness (that deck did have a turn 3 nut draw though and a semi-reliable turn 4 kill)

Heartless Havengul...awesome. I miss machine-gun myr, tattoo demon and sad robot...so does windstrider.

I played the infinite mana combo, it was terrific fun.

Some interesting cards. I wonder if there is a combo you can build around Master of Cruelties?

I actually got thinking about him. I did a quick search...the only cards currently in Standard that have at least four power and first strike or double strike...thus, the only cards that can trade with him 1:1 are Carnival Hellsteed, Gisela, and Minotaur Aggressor. As far as I know, only ONE of those has seen even limited Constructed play. That means that this guy is going to be chewing through his opponents ranks unless they've got some neat tricks to pull, which are always
possible. Indestructibility, for one...and Angelic Skirmisher could just be another one.

You're forgetting Boros Reckoner. He can trade 1:1 as well.

I played the infinite mana combo, it was terrific fun.

As did I. Ah...Priests. I miss that card. So much good red gone...

Master of Cruelties + Hellrider on the board. If he's unblocked, they're dead.

I believe that is not how it works.
Hellrider triggers on attacking (aka declare attackers), but Master of Cruelties also needs to see if he is unblocked (aka declare blockers). So your opponent would get the damage before going to 1.

Gotta love the wurm though

Master of Cruelties + Hellrider on the board. If he's unblocked, they're dead.

I believe that is not how it works.
Hellrider triggers on attacking (aka declare attackers), but Master of Cruelties also needs to see if he is unblocked (aka declare blockers). So your opponent would get the damage before going to 1.

/vouch

That Wurm card is crazy efficient. The creep, the creep!

Dat wurm.

5/5 Trample Flash for 4cc.

That's good. About time GW got some efficiently costed beaters...

Maybe they didn't know how to print a good GW creature without Unburial Rites making it too good.

Sorry, that was sarcastic... I forgot the smilie.

GW has - by far - the most efficient dumb beaters in Standard: 2cc for 3/3, 3cc for 4/4 and now 4cc for 5/5 Trample Flash.

I'm thinking Stompy will have enough juice to be a serious deck.

I think power creeping is over, and power running has begun

I think power creeping is over, and power running has begun

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost ... tcount=119

I think power creeping is over, and power running has begun

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost ... tcount=119

*GASP!*

Master of Cruelties + Hellrider on the board. If he's unblocked, they're dead.

i don't believe that's how the cards you're thinking of work.

5/5 for 4 without fading or shroud hasn't been a sticking point since they tried it in Gruul in Ravnica Block Original Flavor. But none of the previous entries had trample. Or flash. Or interactivity with a passable and potentially untapped block mechanic.
I think the only thing that stands in the way of this card, realistically for the current standard, is that for 4 mana, you're getting a 5/6 flier that wraths your opponent's board or draws you 3 cards or some combination of those things. The card also competes with Resto as a fast 4-drop that provides value and usually has an interaction or 8 with the rest of your deck. It also treads very close to the territory Smiter provides in GW/b decks.

Some negatives to consider. I definitely think this card will recoup whatever play it doesn't see -- whether or not it sees play in INN/RTR standard -- after Innistrad rotates and the Rites/Resto shroud gets lifted.

Being an Instant dodges a fair amount of removal and also will generally equate into a 1-for-0 or 2-for-1 against aggressive decks plus evasion in the form of Trample makes it > just another dumb beater.

I think it'll see play.

It + Snapcaster Mage is also pretty funny...

Heartless Havengul...awesome. I miss machine-gun myr, tattoo demon and sad robot...so does windstrider.

Oh my, yes. Massacre Wurm, Frost Titan, Wurmcoil Engine, Phyrexian Metamorph, Mimic Vat. So many degenerate things that deck could do, and so many ways to win. I want my Sad Robots back, dammit.

Master of Cruelties + Hellrider on the board. If he's unblocked, they're dead.

i don't believe that's how the cards you're thinking of work.

No, you're probably right. Hellrider triggers when attackers are declared. And it would have been such a nice thing.