Primer: Mardu Midrange

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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:45 pm

Thoughts on the version in Craig's article?

http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=12266

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Postby LP, of the Fires » Sat Dec 20, 2014 6:47 am

It's hideous but it harkens back to my previous point; the deck had to fundamentally change to compete with tokens as others cracking doom and changed to the rocks are just aids. He chose doomwake giant and arc trail which serve double duty of fighting jeskai builds and hornet queen.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.

Beatdown is hard, though.


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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Sat Dec 20, 2014 3:05 pm

Glad I got a foil set of Arc Lighting signed at GP Ottawa. Knew it would be good eventually.

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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Sat Dec 20, 2014 3:06 pm

Kind of partial to this list:

http://www.mtgo-stats.com/decks/128974

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Postby Pedrobear » Sat Dec 20, 2014 6:06 pm

I'm currently 7-2 on our Saturday tournaments. Only lost to Abzan aggro and Jeskai Tokens.

My meta is too fluctuent to be able to call something and add Doomwake Giants or Hushwing Gryph so I'm sticking to the base 75. I only added 3 Thoughtseize in SB against some bizarre Control decks I've seen last 2 weeks.

But globaly the deck is really good for me because it totally wrecks all the homemade decks we found there.

I'll stick to it and some PPTQ are in Standard, I'll try to predict the meta.

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Postby Aodh » Wed Dec 24, 2014 6:54 pm

Played Mardu Flash at a Tuesday 16-man tournament yesterday. Went 3-1.

2-1 vs. Gb Devotion
0-2 vs. Naya Walkers
2-0 vs. Mardu Midrange
2-1 vs. MBA

[deck]4 Raise the Alarm
4 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Strike
3 Deflecting Palm
3 Searing Blood
3 Mardu Charm
4 Hushwing Gryff
4 Crackling Doom
1 Devouring Light
4 Stoke the Flames
2 Utter End
1 Murderous Cut
23 lands (7 temples, 4 outpost, 12 pain/basics)

Sideboard

2 Utter End
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
2 Devouring Light
1 Mogis, God of Slaughter
1 Erebos, God of the Dead
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
2 Erase[/deck]

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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Wed Dec 24, 2014 7:34 pm

Why aren't you playing Butcher?

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Postby Aodh » Wed Dec 24, 2014 11:35 pm

It doesn't play on the opponent's turn primarily.

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Postby Valdarith » Thu Dec 25, 2014 4:09 am

Looks like a very bad Jeskai deck.
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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Thu Dec 25, 2014 4:37 am

Aodh » Wed Dec 24, 2014 5:35 pm wrote:It doesn't play on the opponent's turn primarily.


With all those tokens, I think Butcher would shine.

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Postby Aodh » Fri Dec 26, 2014 6:03 pm

Valdarith » Wed Dec 24, 2014 9:09 pm wrote:Looks like a very bad Jeskai deck.


I understand this sentiment. I don't run blue or green, in general, so I didn't have the lands to support U (whether as a fourth color or as one of the three). I don't know if it is "very bad" compared to Jeskai, though. What list? Maybe I can pick out the additions from each color and actually compare them in this metagame.

With all those tokens, I think Butcher would shine.


This might be the case, though there are only 7 token producers compared with the 8-12 in usual Mardu builds, so I don't know if this is actually true. Also, in traditional Mardu, Goblin Rabblemaster serves as both fodder for butcher and a threat on his own. I think this would be a better setting for butcher since they both die to most of the premier removal of this format, but at least it's more likely that one stays alive. In this list, I'd EOT dudes, sac a dude, get 1.5-for-1'd, and then have a 1/1 for the rest of the game. At least with Rabblemaster, you might go Rabble -> token -> mainphase removal from the opponent -> hasty butcher or Rabble -> die -> naked butcher.

The deck played very smoothly and has clean answers in HWG and Utter End/Devouring Light to the rhino that plagues this metagame and really takes advantage from playing on the opponents turn. Perhaps being so narrow-minded is poor, but I wanted to build a deck that can combat rhinos, opposing butchers, and whips, while not being control nor rolling over to aggro. I think this deck appropriately attacks these issues while maintaining the durability and speed that I like.

I will probably be running it again in the next few days. If it fails, I'll run something more traditional at the PPTQ next Saturday, but otherwise I think it is fairly well positioned.

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Postby Valdarith » Sat Dec 27, 2014 5:21 am

Aodh » Fri Dec 26, 2014 11:03 am wrote:
Valdarith » Wed Dec 24, 2014 9:09 pm wrote:Looks like a very bad Jeskai deck.


What list? Maybe I can pick out the additions from each color and actually compare them in this metagame.


Any list that concentrates on acting on opponent's turn. Blue has the best options for swinging tempo and you're choosing not to play them. In particular, you have nothing with haste, no counterspells, and you're playing bad cards like Deflecting Palm. There's literally no reason for you to be playing a "flash" list when Mardu has all of the best cards to be slamming at sorcery speed.
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Postby Toblakai » Tue Dec 30, 2014 6:20 pm

Soulfire Grandmaster is going to be taking Seeker's place for a bit in my build. Any black-leaning builds give Herald of Torment a spin in place of Seeker?

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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Tue Dec 30, 2014 6:26 pm

Bad call.

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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Wed Dec 31, 2014 6:01 am


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Postby Christen » Fri Jan 02, 2015 3:42 pm

Taking my list to the GP tomorrow. Anger x3 or Erase x3 on the sideboard?
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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Fri Jan 02, 2015 4:48 pm

Both? You should have both.

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Postby Christen » Fri Jan 02, 2015 4:53 pm

I have both, only with a 2/3 split.
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Postby Christen » Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:11 pm

Got eaten alive by Abzan Whip decks. 4 losses from a UB control deck and 3 Abzan Whip decks.
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Postby zemanjaski » Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:25 pm

Mardu is unplayable.
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redthirst » Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:20 am wrote:1 - Drunk, surly zem
2 - Nice, modest zem
3 - Bragpost zem
4 - Confident and funny zem
5 - Condescending jerk zem
6 - Self-aware zem


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Postby Christen » Sun Jan 04, 2015 4:03 pm

On a better note though, GP Manila was won by Mardu. List is stock with Utter End mainboard.
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Postby zemanjaski » Sun Jan 04, 2015 4:08 pm

By a good friend of mine, hence the comment.
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redthirst » Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:20 am wrote:1 - Drunk, surly zem
2 - Nice, modest zem
3 - Bragpost zem
4 - Confident and funny zem
5 - Condescending jerk zem
6 - Self-aware zem


Everyone's a winner, we're making our fame,
Bona fide hustler making my name

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Postby Christen » Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:50 am

I was wondering if you somehow knew him.
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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Mon Jan 05, 2015 11:59 am

Mardu is still playable, but the consensus is that RW is better atm.

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Postby zemanjaski » Mon Jan 05, 2015 12:38 pm

Both are bad.
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redthirst » Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:20 am wrote:1 - Drunk, surly zem
2 - Nice, modest zem
3 - Bragpost zem
4 - Confident and funny zem
5 - Condescending jerk zem
6 - Self-aware zem


Everyone's a winner, we're making our fame,
Bona fide hustler making my name

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Postby Valdarith » Mon Jan 05, 2015 1:44 pm

Terrible.
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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:00 pm

Win / top 8 GPs a day ago, must be bad :P

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Postby Valdarith » Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:01 pm

Be quiet. We're too busy making thinly veiled sarcastic comments.
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Postby zemanjaski » Mon Jan 05, 2015 9:41 pm

Lightning_Dolt » Tue Jan 06, 2015 4:00 am wrote:Win / top 8 GPs a day ago, must be bad :P


I really hope that's not how you evaluate decks; that's some sick confirmation bias.
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redthirst » Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:20 am wrote:1 - Drunk, surly zem
2 - Nice, modest zem
3 - Bragpost zem
4 - Confident and funny zem
5 - Condescending jerk zem
6 - Self-aware zem


Everyone's a winner, we're making our fame,
Bona fide hustler making my name

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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:14 pm

It's the closest thing we have to demonstrable evidence :shrug:

I think it's fair to say both are good / competitive decks.

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Postby LP, of the Fires » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:48 pm

I'd say mardu's pretty mediocre insofar as positioning in the meta goes.

The RW agro and token decks however are both excellent. Sam Black was 9-2 before punting left and right vs. Heroic Builds and Sam Pardee was running a clinic on people for the most part. I'd attest his loss in top 8 to a bad judgement call in his game 1 loss to Sperling, but overall both versions are phenomenal, almost solely based off of them being 2 color and having such a large tempo advantage against the rest of the format due to clean mana and the most efficient questions and answers.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.

Beatdown is hard, though.


Patrick chapin

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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Mon Jan 05, 2015 11:47 pm

I like you LP.

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Postby Valdarith » Tue Jan 06, 2015 2:28 am

LP, of the Fires » Mon Jan 05, 2015 3:48 pm wrote:I'd say mardu's pretty mediocre insofar as positioning in the meta goes.

The RW agro and token decks however are both excellent. Sam Black was 9-2 before punting left and right vs. Heroic Builds and Sam Pardee was running a clinic on people for the most part. I'd attest his loss in top 8 to a bad judgement call in his game 1 loss to Sperling, but overall both versions are phenomenal, almost solely based off of them being 2 color and having such a large tempo advantage against the rest of the format due to clean mana and the most efficient questions and answers.


I'm a big fan of Pardee's list. Stormbreath Dragon is just so good right now.
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Postby jsilv » Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:12 am

The Boros deck is pretty good right now. Pardee time tends not to pick unplayable garbage decks and his record with the deck irl tournaments is like 22-5. Basically every deck Partytime or Holiday play can be guaranteed to have a pretty good Forests match.

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Postby Valdarith » Wed Jan 07, 2015 3:54 pm

Hopefully I can reproduce his success this weekend. I'm playing his deck with only two cards difference.
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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Wed Jan 07, 2015 7:37 pm

Why not run his 75?

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Postby Valdarith » Wed Jan 07, 2015 8:17 pm

Because I feel like in matchups where I want three Hushwing Gryff, I really want four. Holliday agrees. I also swapped the single Ashcloud out for a third Brimaz for local meta expectations.

It's not like I'm just blindly making changes without putting any thought into them.
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Postby LP, of the Fires » Wed Jan 07, 2015 9:46 pm

For the GP, Pardee actually updated his deck to have 4 Hushwyngs. He cut the land from his sideboard to make room then swapped a gryff and a Chandra between main and board.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.

Beatdown is hard, though.


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Postby Lightning_Dolt » Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:11 pm


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Postby Valdarith » Wed Jan 07, 2015 11:28 pm

Seems like we're on a similar page then.
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