[Brewing] Shattergang Stax - Drinking the Haterade

[redthirst]

So, I have a combo EDH deck, and I have an Aggro EDH deck, but I don't have a Control EDH deck and these guys look like they could be fun:

Shattergang Brothers [mana]1brg[/mana]
Legendary Creature - Goblin Artificer (M)
[mana]2B[/mana], Sacrifice a creature: Each other player sacrifices a creature.
[mana]2R[/mana], Sacrifice a artifact: Each other player sacrifices an artifact.
[mana]2G[/mana], Sacrifice an enchantment: Each other player sacrifices an enchantment.
3/3

In addition, I can likely port over most of my Goblin engine from Purphoros to build a large chunk of the creature portion of the deck.

Mostly all I have right now is a rough outline of where I want the deck to go, I know that I want:
1. Roughly equal parts Creatures, Artifacts, and Enchantments to be able to destroy whatever I
want whenever I want.
2. As many spells that fit as many of those criteria as possible (Wurmcoil is Artifact + Creature, Sarcomancy is Creature + Enchantment, Hammer of Purphoros makes tokens that are all 3, etc.)
3. Lots of defense. This is a Control deck that's going to piss everyone at the table off so I need to be able to ride all that hate. In addition, a 3/3 is not the hardest thing in the world to answer so I need to be able to protect it.
4. Lots of mana. This idea looks to be greedy as hell. It needs all the mana.

Cards that I'm pretty sure I want to play based on their success in Purphoros:
[cards]Goblin Welder
Goblin Recruiter
Mogg War Marshal
Imperial Recruiter
Goblin Matron
Moggcatcher
Goblin Settler
Beetleback Chief
Flametongue Kavu
Goblin Ringleader
Siege-Gang Commander
Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
Solemn Simulacrum
Precursor Golem
Mimic Vat
Gamble
Sensei's Divining Top
Wheel of Fortune
Sulfuric Vortex
Mind's Eye
Mindslaver
Hammer of Purphoros[/
cards]
All the mana rocks

Other cards that I believe warrant consideration:
[cards]Wurmcoil Engine
Sarcomancy (Creature + Enchantment)
Any Eldrazi Drones
Awakening Zone
Grave Pact
Sprouting Thrinax
Creakwood Liege
Survival of the Fittest
Birthing Pod
Tutors
Sek'Kuar, Deathkeeper
Swagtusk
Harvester of Souls
Blood Moon
Destructive Flow
Stranglehold[/cards]

All right, that's what I've got right now so give me some more ideas.

11/04/13 Update

Decided to go a STAX route with Shattergang because that seems like a natural strategy for this particular Commander and will absolutely attract the raw amount of hate I'll be trolling for.

Preliminary STAX decklist:
[deck]
Commander: 1
1 Shattergang Brothers

Creatures: 26
1 Goblin Welder
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Wall of Blossoms
1 Fauna Shaman
1 Bloodghast
1 Sylvan Ranger
1 Glissa, the Traitor
1 Burnished Hart
1 Ophiomancer
1 Eternal Witness
1
Yavimaya Elder
1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Savra, Queen of the Golgari
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Magus of the Abyss
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Reaper of the Wilds
1 Zealous Conscripts
1 Thragtusk
1 Precursor Golem
1 Genesis
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Harvester of Souls
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One

Noncreature Artifacts: 18
1 Mana Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Gruul Signet
1 Golgari Signet
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Fellwar Stone
1 Ichor Wellspring
1 Mycosynth Wellspring
1 Winter Orb
1 Tangle Wire
1 Coalition Relic
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Mimic Vat
1 Smokestack
1 Trading Post
1 Birthing Pod
1 Crucible of Worlds

Enchantments: 11
1 Survival of the Fittest
1 Oversold Cemetery
1 Sylvan Library
1 Blood Moon
1 Destructive Flow
1 Awakening Zone
1 Necropotence
1 The Abyss
1 Nether Void
1 Grave Pact
1 Perilous Forays

Enchantment Artifacts: 2
1 Hammer of Purphoros
1 Whip of Erebos

Planeswalkers: 1
1 Liliana of the Veil

nInstants and Sorceries: 4
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Jarad's Orders
1 Diabolic Tutor

Lands: 37
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Jund Panorama
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Wasteland
1 Stripmine
13 Swamp
10 Forest
5 Mountain
[/deck]

[Azrael]

If you're a control deck, are you sure little goblins are the best way to go? That sounds like it'd wind up being more towards the aggro-side of aggro-control. Obviously, cheap creatures are a good way to make his ability more economical, but things with ETBs like Eternal Witness, Wood Elves, Fierce Empath, seem like a better route for a control deck. Really though, it seems like maybe this general is better built as an aggressive token-based strategy than a card-advantage/attrition engine. Build up a tempo advantage, and then just blast away everyone's expensive blockers. I guess that'd partly depend on having enough built-in token steroids for these colors though - I think there's enough if you wanted to, though there isn't a stand-out option ala Mirror Entity in these colors. Marton Stromgald, lol? Maybe Elves are another viable route?

As for tokens in particular as opposed to straight goblins, it seems much more
mana efficient to pay as little mana as possible on creatures you're just saccing anyways, and tokens maximize that efficency.

Artifact creatures would obviously provide some good versatility. Unfortunate that there's so few that are well-suited for EDH.

Reanimating the threats you just killed on the opposite side of the board seems like one of the more effective applications, particularly if you're leaning towards a control angle, still. Animate Dead, Necromancy, Diabolic Servitude all seem like pretty sweet synergistic options.

I like the Blood Moon/Magus of the Moon angle - effects that you want to apply to your opponents, but not to yourself. You could add Contamination to that list, probably, especially if you're going token-heavy.

Would it be silly to recommend "Threaten" effects? It turns your Shattergang into pretty sweet targeted removal in addition to the global sac, gives you a nice tempo boost with the extra attack, and saves you the mana on having to cast a creature
of your own, just to sac it later on.

Grave Titan and Bloodghast probably belong on this list. Shriekmaw. Boneshredder. Avenger of Zendikar. Mana Reflection. Terastodon/Natural Order.

Maybe even Mana Flare and that one green/red three mana enchantment from Invasion that also doubles your mana - give yourself a nice boost and sac when it suits you. Helps with the deck being mana hungry, and provides some good political options too.

[redthirst]

I've been looking around at options and I think you're right Azrael, I'm leaning towards cheap dudes with ETB abilities that continue to set me up rather than just spamming tokens.

I also think I'm going to go with mana disruption like Blood Moon/Magus/Destructive Flow and a mana base full of Basics that relies on creatures/artifacts for mana fixing. I'd do this for a few reasons:
1. Turn 2-3 Blood Moon or Destructive Flow is ridiculous,
2. It gives me more permanents to sac to the Shattergang Bros, and
3. It saves me a few hundred on the mana base.

Reanimation is strong and I think I'll try and squeeze a few sources of it in - at least Whip of Erebos and Corpse Dance.

I like the idea of Threaten effects, but I'm uncertain I'll be able to fit any besides Zealous Conscripts and possibly that instant speed one
that uses Phyrexian mana in.

I could not disagree more about global acceleration, though. IME when you're playing a Commander that does stuff to everyone that they all hate then all that the accel does is give them more resources to use to gang up on you.

Here's a rough draft for the first list - I'm trying to keep it as low casting cost as possible so there are probably some better spells I could be playing but I learned early on testing Purph that plenty of cheap spells you can cast > a ton of great spells you can't.

[deck]
Commander: 1
1 Shattergang Brothers

Creatures: 26
1 Bloodghast
1 Fauna Shaman
1 Wall of Blossoms
1 Gatecreeper Vine
1 Sylvan Ranger
1 Viridian Emissary
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Glissa, the Traitor
1 Imperial Recruiter
1 Eternal Witness
1 Yavimaya Elder
1 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Reaper of the Wilds
1 Sangromancer
1 Savra, Queen of the Golgari
1 Kozilek's Predator
1 Olivia Voldaren
1 Thragtusk
1 Zealous
Conscripts
1 Precursor Golem
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Harvester of Souls
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One

Artifacts: 18
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Sol Ring
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Skullclamp
1 Grim Monolith
1 Golgari Signet
1 Gruul Signet
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Talisman of Impulse
1 Talisman of Indulgence
1 Ichor Wellspring
1 Mycosynth Wellspring
1 Champion's Helm
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Coalition Relic
1 Mimic Vat
1 Birthing Pod

Enchantments: 12
1 Ground Seal
1 Oversold Cemetery
1 Survival of the Fittest
1 Sylvan Library
1 Awakening Zone
1 Blood Moon
1 Destructive Flow
1 Necropotence
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Underworld Connections
1 Grave Pact
1 Stranglehold

Artifact Enchantments: 2
1 Hammer of Purphoros
1 Whip of Erebos

Spells: 5
1 Gamble
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Corpse Dance
1 Diabolic Tutor

Lands: 36
[/deck]

I know Ground Seal looks weird with the little bit of recursion, but it draws a card and if it hurts me more than
them I figure I can always sac it.

[Azrael]

Yeah, my vision for the global accel was play it, use it as a mega dark ritual when you have lots of mana, and sac immediately unless you need to team up to squish someone. Which is probably a really bad and conditional sort of thing to include. It just makes me giggle to think of using Heartbeat of Spring to double mana like a one-shot doubling cube while obliterating everyone's enchantments simultaneously.

[Azrael]

Which reminds me, you should run doubling cube.

[redthirst]

Updated the OP to take the deck in a slightly different direction.

[Azrael]

Possessed Portal, Chaos Warp? No more Gamble? Decree of Pain? Pernicious Deed? Seems like you need some spells that are capable of wiping out weenies and tokens, for maximal effectiveness.

Garruk Wildspeaker? Liliana Vess? Rapacious One?

[redthirst]

Possessed Portal is way too expensive with no reliable way to cheat it out - especially in a deck that relies on board-wide sacrifice and tax effects.
Gamble is just not as good as the Black tutors.
The rest of the suggestions were good, but could you also list suggestions of what to take out instead of just listing cards that would be good in the archetype?

[Helios]

What about taking out Whip (which is cute and all, but eh) and putting in Curse of Death's Hold or the thing that gives creature tokens -1/-1? That way your sac effects will have maximum value, because they can't just sac 1/1s and such to them.

[Azrael]

My skeptical list would be:

1 Solemn Simulacrum (Too expensive, and bad spot in the curve)
1 Sangromancer (conditional lifegain?)
1 Kozilek's Predator (Pretty low game impact)
1 Zealous Conscripts - A threaten effect, but very expensive.
1 Hammer of Purphoros - Pretty mana hungry. Not much use for the haste in this version, though that could easily change.
1 Coalition Relic and Chromatic Lantern - Awkward spot on the mana curve. You usually want to ramp to 4, not 5.

As a general observation, this deck is less splashy and more like a type 2 deck than an EDH curve than is usual. That's likely to hurt you, if your lockdown plan A fails. There's not much finishing power. Nothing says "I cast this and now you die". It's more like - "please don't have a 3/3 that can kill my Thragtusk, kind sir."

[redthirst]

My skeptical list would be:

1 Solemn Simulacrum (Too expensive, and bad spot in the curve)
1 Sangromancer (conditional lifegain?)
1 Kozilek's Predator (Pretty low game impact)
1 Zealous Conscripts - A threaten effect, but very expensive.
1 Hammer of Purphoros - Pretty mana hungry. Not much use for the haste in this version, though that could easily change.
1 Coalition Relic and Chromatic Lantern - Awkward spot on the mana curve. You usually want to ramp to 4, not 5.

As a general observation, this deck is less splashy and more like a type 2 deck than an EDH curve than is usual. That's likely to hurt you, if your lockdown plan A fails. There's not much finishing power. Nothing says "I cast this and now you die". It's more like - "please don't
have a 3/3 that can kill my Thragtusk, kind sir."

1. Solemn Simulacrum - could not disagree more. It does everything this deck wants a support spell to do. It provides mana fixing, a relevant CA ability upon entering and leaving the battlefield, and is multiple permanent types to activate SB's abilities. In addition, it provides synergy with Trading Post, Welder, and Glissa.
2. Sangromancer - Not in the current list.
3. Predator - Not in the current list.
The most current list is the one in the OP, for reference it is this:

---

[deck]Commander: 1
1 Shattergang Brothers
Creatures: 26
1 Goblin Welder
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Wall of Blossoms
1 Fauna Shaman
1 Bloodghast
1 Sylvan Ranger
1 Glissa, the Traitor
1 Burnished Hart
1 Ophiomancer
1 Eternal Witness
1 Yavimaya Elder
1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Savra, Queen of the Golgari
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Magus of the Abyss
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Reaper of
the Wilds
1 Zealous Conscripts
1 Thragtusk
1 Precursor Golem
1 Genesis
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Harvester of Souls
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One
Noncreature Artifacts: 18
1 Mana Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Gruul Signet
1 Golgari Signet
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Fellwar Stone
1 Ichor Wellspring
1 Mycosynth Wellspring
1 Winter Orb
1 Tangle Wire
1 Coalition Relic
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Mimic Vat
1 Smokestack
1 Trading Post
1 Birthing Pod
1 Crucible of Worlds
Enchantments: 11
1 Survival of the Fittest
1 Oversold Cemetery
1 Sylvan Library
1 Blood Moon
1 Destructive Flow
1 Awakening Zone
1 Necropotence
1 The Abyss
1 Nether Void
1 Grave Pact
1 Perilous Forays
Enchantment Artifacts: 2
1 Hammer of Purphoros
1 Whip of Erebos
Planeswalkers: 1
1 Liliana of the Veil
Instants and Sorceries: 4
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Jarad's Orders
1 Diabolic Tutor
Lands: 37
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Jund
Panorama
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
13 Swamp
10 Forest
5 Mountain
[/deck]

4. Zealous Conscripts - I like it, but I could certainly cut it.
5. Hammer - Not in the deck to make everything Haste, but because it makes Enchantment Artifact Creature tokens for SB. Also, since the average spell cost is pretty low for an EDH deck, the chances that I'll have extra land are probably pretty good.
6. 3-Mana Rocks - In the deck more for their mana fixing than for ramp, but they are a possibility to be cut.

Re: General Observation - that's intentional. I'm playing global tax and sac effects so the point is to make a deck that can still play its spells while my opponents are stuck with a bunch of flashy "I win" spells that they don't have the resources to play. Sure a Thragtusk on the board doesn't measure up against a Sylvan Primordial, but a Thragtusk on the board looks pretty good against a Primordial in the
hand that they can't possibly cast for at least 5 turns.

Really, the MU that was bothering me (theoretically, of course) was any token strategy because, you were right, I don't really have an easy way to reset them and get back a favorable board position. So, for that, I think I'm going to find room for Ratchet Bomb and maybe Powder Keg. Both wipe out tokens very cheaply and can be recurred with Glissa, Welder, and Trading Post.