R/b Burn

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Postby Khaospawn » Wed Feb 19, 2014 10:10 pm

More proof of the awesomeness that is Patrick Sullivan.
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Postby hamfactorial » Wed Feb 19, 2014 10:35 pm

Excellent article, especially the bit about T1 Mountain say go.

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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Feb 20, 2014 12:31 am

Playing a Turn 1 Mountain is the most important and powerful thing anyone can do.
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Postby LaZerBurn » Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:12 am

^ One of the best MTG articles I've ever read :)
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:25 am

It's definitely one of his best. Required reading for any Red Mage, in my opinion.
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Postby magicdownunder » Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:53 pm

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Postby LaZerBurn » Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:24 pm

So Dominik Prosek came in 19th at Pro Tour BNG with Rbw Burn :) His list will be posted later today, this gives a bit of a sneak preview :)

I've been playing the deck in 2 mans. I know it's bad for EV and for meta MDU :) but time and it's allowed me to get a feel for the different match ups. I'm still really enjoying the deck and my current 75 looks like this. The MD seems pretty fixed with 2/3 'flex' slots - the Faithless Looting, the Flame Javelin and possibly the 20th land; I'm very
interested in how you do with 19 land MDU. I've seen both sides of Faithless Looting now, when it swaps you 2 land for 2 burn spells it's amazing but it's not a good top deck and when you draw it in your opening hand it can sit there for the whole game. 1 is enough and I can see dropping it all together. The singleton Flame Javelin has been good so far, 4 to the dome is always good and as it improves Twin G1. I could see going to 2 depending on what the meta turns out like. In the SB Ensnaring Bridge has been excellent, [card]Hell's Thunder[/card] is great tech against Wall Of Omens MDU and I like the flexibility of Torpor Orb over Combust.

[deck]
Land 20
5 Mountain
4 Arid Mesa
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Blood Crypt
1 Stomping Ground

Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Grim Lavamancer
4 Vexing Devil

Burn
28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Bump in the Night
4 Skullcrack
3 Searing Blaze
3 Shard Volley
1 Flame Javelin
1 Faithless Looting

Sideboard 15
3 Rakdos Charm
3 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Rain Of Gore
2 Torpor Orb
2 Destructive Revelry
1 Searing Blaze
[/deck]

My SBing plan looks like this - comments and feedback VERY WELCOME :D
SB Plan
Affinity
-4 Goblin Guide
-2 Lava Spike
+1 Searing Blaze
+3 Rakdos Charm
+2 Destructive Revelry

UWr Control
-3 Searing Blaze
-1 Flame Javelin
+2 Hell's thunder
+2 Rain Of Gore

Melira Pod
-4 Goblin Guide
-4 Vexing Devil
+3 Ensnaring Bridge
+3 Destructive Revelry
+2 Torpor Orb

Splinter Twin Tricky as there are a number of variants now
-3 Searing Blaze
-2 Skulllcrack
+3 Rakdos Charm
+2 Torpor Orb

RG Tron

-3 Searing Blaze
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Rakdos Charm

Scapeshift
-3x Searing Blaze
+2x Hell's Thunder
+1x Rain Of Gore

Merfolk
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Searing Blaze
+3 Ensnaring Bridge
-2?
-4 Goblin Guide

Zoo
+1 Searing Blaze
+3 Ensnaring Bridge
- 4 Goblin Guide

Bogles
-3 Searing Blaze
+3 Ensnaring Bridge

BUG Infect
+1 Searing Blaze
+3 Ensnaring Bridge
- 4 Skullcrack

UR Storm
+ 3 Rakdos Charm
- 3 Searing Blaze

Living End
+3 Ensnaring Bridge
+3 Rakdos Charm
-4 Grim Lavamancer
-2 Goblin Guide
Last edited by LaZerBurn on Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby magicdownunder » Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:35 pm

I take it that you have concluded that Faithless Looting is much too cute? (I haven't tested it myself yet so if you believe is so I won't bother with it - since it does look cute to me as well)

In regards to the board, I agree with Destructive Revelry vs Merfolk - I personally don't understand Ensnaring Bridge vs Affinity or Fae, why isn't Ensnaring Bridge being used against Living End?

What are your thoughts on 4x Shard Volley? Texan swears by them I'm slowly understanding the appeal as well :smileup:
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Postby LaZerBurn » Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:44 pm

Yeah Looting is too cute. I really like it but I think the slot can be better used.

I've edited my SB - dropped Bridge against Affinity (overkill) and put it in against Living End (glaring omission) I've no idea why I typed it up as coming in Vs Fae, I've never brought it in! :)

I really like Shard Volley :) I like 3 (don't like to see too many in my opening hand) but I can see dropping the Looting and going to 4, especially with 20 land :smileup:

Lists are up, some strange choices IMHO - check Dominik Prosek, Ogie
Jaro, Jasper Jonson-Epstein and Stephan Neal :)
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Postby Khaospawn » Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:55 am

Here was his Burn list:

[deck]
lands 20
4 Arid Mesa
2 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Blood Crypt
2 Marsh Flats
4 Mountain
2 Sacred Foundry
4 Scalding Tarn

creatures 8
4 Goblin Guide
4 Vexing Devil

spells 32
4 Boros Charm
4 Bump in the Night
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
4 Shard Volley
4 Skullcrack


Sideboard
2 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Flamebreak
2 Satyr Firedancer
3 Searing Blood
4 Smash to Smithereens
2 Torpor Orb[/deck]
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Postby LaZerBurn » Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:53 pm

The results from the Pro Tour have me wondering if it's worth running Boros Charm and if so do we need to run more fetch lands - 1/2 Marsh Flats? My initial thoughts are that while Boros Charm is an excellent card I can't say I've missed it and I can't see the need for more fetches even without DRS in the deck. What do you think guys?

In the interests of having everything in the same place and because I like stuff like this here's the data and the other lists :)

In the meta game analysis out of 100 matches Burn recorded an average win% of 48.67. Dominik Prosek, whose list Khaos has kindly posted above, was the best placed Burn player, finishing 27th on 22 points in the Constructed rankings. Jaspe
Johnson-Epstein also finished with 22 points for 32nd place and Ogie Jaro and Stephen Neal both finished on 18 points. My interest in these matters does not extent to scouring the results to find out exactly what they all won and lost to :) While there seems to be a fair bit of room for personal preference; Prosek's list differs by 6 cards from Epstein and Neal's (who both ran the same MD) and by 9 from Jaro's, assuming I can count, one thing all of the lists agree on is the inclusion of Boros Charm (Prosek was the only one not to run Lightning Helix too) and no-one is running G for Destructive Revelry (which I really like).
Jaspe Johnson-Epstein
[deck]Jaspe Johnson-Epstein[/deck]
Stephen Neal
[deck]Stephen Neal[/deck]
Ogie Jaro
[deck]Ogie Jaro[/deck]
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Postby magicdownunder » Mon Feb 24, 2014 8:25 pm

Boros Charm is great it help you get in for 20 much easier, the only issue is that you'll need to be willing to take 6 damage on T2 more often (which wouldn't matter if Zoo wasn't every 2nd match).
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Postby Khaospawn » Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:04 pm

I took down a 4 round Modern tourney at my LGS last night.

[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Grim Lavamancer
4 Vexing Devil

Burn 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Bump In The Night
4 Skullcrack
4 Searing Blaze
1 Shard Volley
3 Flames of the Bloodhand

Land 20
4 Arid Mesa
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Mountain
2 Blood Crypt
2 Stomping Ground

Sideboard 15
4 Searing Blood
4 Rakdos Charm
4 Destructive Revelry
1 Flamebreak
2 Anger of the Gods
[/deck]

Round 1 - Affinity 2-1
Round 2 - Melira Pod 2-0
Round 3 - Tempo Twin 2-0
Round 4 - U/W Control 2-1

Here's what I learned:

1) Grim Lavamancer is still bonkers. I actually thought about cutting him before the tournament. I'm so glad I didn't. He's basically the only reason I didn't lose to Affinity and Pod. He also sealed the deal in one game against U/W.

2) My sideboard is REALLY good against Affinity and
Pod. After slapping the sideboard together, I didn't even realize that all 15 cards could just go right in.

3) Beating Twin with a Rakdos Charm is always fun.

4) There's actually a lot of cards in the deck that don't care about Spellskite. This makes me happy.
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Postby Platypus » Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:48 pm

How important would you say that Vexing Devils are in the deck? If you had to replace them, what would you choose instead?

I like this because we have Twin, Affinity, and Pod players in our meta. But I have refused to get VDs so far...
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Postby Khaospawn » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:01 pm

How important would you say that Vexing Devils are in the deck? If you had to replace them, what would you choose instead?

I like this because we have Twin, Affinity, and Pod players in our meta. But I have refused to get VDs so far...
VD is actually pretty good now. I wouldn't say that he's mandatory, as evidenced by one of the lists Lazer posted from the PT, but being able to deal 4 damage is very good and VD generally does that the majority of the time.
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Postby Platypus » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:05 pm

Yeah, I had hoped they'd gone down in price after the rotation, but it just went slightly up. And sold out at my go to place. Oh well, might try some of the old staples (Hellspark/Spark Elemental, or Keldon Marauders) in its place.
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Postby magicdownunder » Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:06 am

I'm BACK! (not that was away for long) and I went 3-0 right away with my new and improved list ;-):

[deck=MDU's Rx Burn]Creatures 10
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Vexing Devil

Burn 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Bump In The Night
3 Skullcrack
4 Searing Blaze
4 Shard Volley
2 Flames of the Blood Hand
1 Faithless Looting

Land 20
4 Arid Mesa
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
5 Mountain
2 Blood Crypt
1 Stomping Ground

Sideboard 15
3 Hell's Thunder
3 Rakdos Charm
3 Anger of the Gods
2 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Destructive Revelry
1 Grim Lavamancer
1 Back to Nature[/deck]

@Khaospawn: Well done, I love the Flames of the Blood Hand in your list
@Platypus: I think VD is vital in winning the Scapeshift and Tron race, though Keldon Marauders is better vs Robots, Twin and Pod.
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:10 pm

Thanks, MDU. I switched over to Flames cuz I'd much rather stop some life gain than kill a Colonnade.
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Postby Platypus » Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:13 pm

@Platypus: I think VD is vital in winning the Scapeshift and Tron race, though Keldon Marauders is better vs Robots, Twin and Pod.
We have more of the second list than the first in our meta, so Keldon Marauders it is then.
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:04 pm

Question for you guys running Vexing Devil - in the Pod Match-up, or any deck that runs Scavenging Ooze (like a form of Zoo), do you guys find yourselves sideboarding out Vexing Devil so that it doesn't provide life gain fodder? I did that during my Pod match-up, however, I don't know if it was the correct play or not. The plan has its merits but I question whether 1 or 2 points of extra life that your opponent will gain is enough to worry about (though a 4/4 or bigger Ooze can get dangerous somewhat quick in a slower paced game).
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Postby magicdownunder » Fri Feb 28, 2014 12:00 am

I keep the VD vs Pod, but that is because I have nothing else better to replace it with :( VD def. isn't the greatest card vs Pod (though he is still better then Goblin Guide in that MU).
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Postby Khaospawn » Fri Feb 28, 2014 2:09 am

Against Pod with your deck, I'd probably board in all the Angers, Charms, Revelry, and the Lavamancer. That's 9 cards. Cut the Devils, Guides, and maybe the Looting? It raises your 3 drop count , but all the cards are useful.
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Postby magicdownunder » Fri Feb 28, 2014 11:28 am

I don't really like Charms and Revelry against Pod, since I rather kill them then take out Pod though I'll admit hitting SS is nice....
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Postby Khaospawn » Fri Feb 28, 2014 1:27 pm

I had to use a Charm once to kill the infinite life combo with Finks. Taking out a Pod or a Skite is nice, but I admit Charm isn't completely necessary for winning.
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Postby MisterMet » Fri Feb 28, 2014 6:04 pm

All 3 modes of Charm have been very good against Pod, especially since most Pod players I've gone up against love to play Voice of Resurgence as early as possible.

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Postby magicdownunder » Sat Mar 01, 2014 4:32 am

IDK - my experience with Pod, I had my opp. on 3 life - I topdeck Charm I attempt to kill him with damage mode he sac everything but two cards :sweat: then proceeds to finish me.

Modern burn is all about making the most of your resources so as soon as you cram your list with "if" and "maybes" you gas out (imo anyways).
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Postby Platypus » Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:58 pm

So have any of you tried out Satyr Firedancer in the deck?
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Postby Khaospawn » Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:51 pm

Not me. Not yet, anyway. I don't get a chance to test much. I just suit up with what I know and go with it.
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Postby Platypus » Sat Mar 01, 2014 8:39 pm

Yeah, that's my problem as well. But I traded for some Firedancers today, and I noticed them in some of the PT lists which is why I'm curious.
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Postby magicdownunder » Mon Mar 03, 2014 12:25 am

Really stupid T3-4 win build (everything is 1cc):

[deck=MDU's Faithless Miracles]Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Vexing Devil
4 Spark Elemental

Burn 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Bump In The Night
4 Shard Volley
4 Thunderous Wrath
4 Forked Bolt

Garbage Cleaning 03
3 Faithless Looting

Land 17
4 Arid Mesa
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
3 Mountain
2 Blood Crypt

Sideboard 15
1 Stomping Ground
1 Sacred Foundry
2 Destructive Revelry
3 Rakdos Charm
4 Boros Charm
4 Searing Blaze[/deck]

Could be so bad that its good :smileup:
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Postby LaZerBurn » Mon Mar 03, 2014 1:28 pm

Really stupid T3-4 win build (everything is 1cc):Could be so bad that its good :smileup:
This is without doubt the craziest list I've seen of yours :D If this was posted by anyone else I'd dismiss it on sight; it looks horrible with 4 Thunderous Wrath and 3 Faithless Looting :o but based on the fact you've posted soooo many excellent lists I'll try it before I pass judgement :)
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Postby magicdownunder » Mon Mar 03, 2014 1:34 pm

Really stupid T3-4 win build (everything is 1cc):Could be so bad that its good :smileup:
This is without doubt the craziest list I've seen of yours :D If this was posted by anyone else I'd dismiss it on sight; it looks horrible with 4 Thunderous Wrath and 3 Faithless Looting :o but based on the fact you've posted soooo many
excellent lists I'll try it before I pass judgement :)
Thank goodness your willing to test it, I couldn't bring myself to try it since I detest the practice room and 2-mans :rofl:
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Postby LaZerBurn » Mon Mar 03, 2014 2:31 pm

2-1 Vs UW - 5 damage for R is quite good :)

2-0 Vs Storm - 5 damage for R is quite good :)

2-0 Vs B Discard (homebrew?)

0-2 Vs Affinity - needed to draw a 3rd land G2, sided in 2 to go up to 19 for Searing Blaze, Rakdos Charm and Revelry

1-2 Vs WBG homebrew - 5 damage for R is quite good :) But not as good as T1 Leyline :(

2-1 Vs Kibler Zoo - 5 damage for R is quite good :)

I don't like it as much a the lists we've been playing but Thunderous Wrath is very good (and the 3 Faithless Looting worked well for
getting rid of any from my opening hand) and I'm now wondering if we could work Thunderous Wrath into the old list? :)
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Mar 06, 2014 8:26 pm

I'm liking P-Sully's Burn list here at the bottom of his latest article about the last SCG event. It appeals to me since my meta is pretty aggro-heavy in Modern.

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/28 ... South.html

Plus, the 3/1 split on Lavamancer and Figure of Destiny is just sexy.
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Postby BlakLanner » Thu Mar 06, 2014 10:24 pm

So have any of you tried out Satyr Firedancer in the deck?
I play RWb Burn but I have to say that I am loving the Firedancers. I pack 3 in the sideboard to help fight against the creature-based matchups. Never lost a game where I got one on the battlefield.
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Postby magicdownunder » Fri Mar 07, 2014 1:36 am

I'm liking P-Sully's Burn list here at the bottom of his latest article about the last SCG event. It appeals to me since my meta is pretty aggro-heavy in Modern.

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/28 ... South.html

Plus, the 3/1 split on Lavamancer and Figure of Destiny is just sexy.
OMG :love: it looks awesome (except for 8x Searing - WHAT ABOUT COMBO just roll over and die???), I almost want a 2nd FoD - what would you bring Phyrexian Revoker against? Surely not UWr, maybe Merfolk, Affinity and Pod?

Def. gonna use that as the base for my future brews
also loving the Relic of Progenitus :D
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Postby Khaospawn » Fri Mar 07, 2014 3:43 pm

He said he tested a lot against Affinity. Seems legit.
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Postby PrimalBurn » Sat Mar 08, 2014 8:11 pm

Playing Sullivans list just made a UWR player rage quit when I won through 3 helix lol silly lifegain. Snapcaster sure makes a nice target for those searing bloods :)

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Postby magicdownunder » Sun Mar 09, 2014 1:11 am

Did you pair with Tron, Scapeshift, Living End, Gifts, Amulets, Storm or Ad Nauseam yet? How were the 8 Searing effect then?
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Postby BlakLanner » Mon Mar 10, 2014 4:28 am

Any thoughts to adding white for Helix, Boros Charm, etc?

[deck]
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Arid Mesa
2 Blood Crypt
2 Sacred Foundry
2 Dragonskull Summit
2 Clifftop Retreat
4 Mountain

4 Goblin Guide
4 Vexing Devil
2 Grim Lavamancer

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
4 Bump in the Night
4 Boros Charm
4 Searing Blaze
3 Lightning Helix
3 Magma Jet

Sideboard
3 Rakdos Charm
2 Torpor Orb
3 Hide // Seek
3 Satyr Firedancer
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Shrine of Burning Rage
1 Anger of the Gods[/deck]
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DCI Rules Advisor
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BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.
Currently Playing
Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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