[Primer] Boros Burn

[zemanjaski]

Yeah run the Chandra, it's a card worth getting better with.

[magicdownunder]

I think for paper, you probably want the YP$ version. Just my $0.02.

Why do you believe running the non-YP$ version is better for MODO but not RL? (I think its important to justify these types of comments)

The life total is kinda important when Uw Devotions and Burn are in the top4 of the meta game, I'll admit T//T would improve your Burn and Esper MU but YP$ improve everything else - including Bx which is on the top of the meta game....(+ you don't need too risk the 4 extra shock lands).

- - - - - - - - - - - - -

As some of you may know, I haven't been able to play any games as of late - but here are some videos of my early trails of building the "Angry Phoenix, Happy Chandra" list.

Report DE
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G1 Jund Monster vs Chandra's Zurm (MDU) DE 6923093
G2 B Aggro (DaBones) vs Chandra's Zurm (MDU) DE 6923093
G3 GB Dredge (Cabelo_PE) vs Chandra's Zurm (MDU) DE 6923093
G4 Split

[rage_jl]

Managed to trick a UW player into Reving for four while I was tapped out on his turn so I could Trouble him for 7 and then skull crack him for the win. Made my day.

[TBuzzsaw]

Managed to trick a UW player into Reving for four while I was tapped out on his turn so I could Trouble him for 7 and then skull crack him for the win. Made my day.

My favorite was when my opponent was at 10 and I had four untapped lands and two Skullcracks in hand. I play scryland (see Boros Charm), pass turn. I pretend to look anxious and impatient, and make sure my opponent sees this. He gives the look that he has this in the bag, plays his 8th land pass turn. In response I skullcrack. He sphinx in response as predicted. Skullcrack again. Draw card, shake hand. After the game he had a counter in hand, but due to my false body language he thought I lost my patience and didn't anticipate another skullcrack by how fast and confident I tried playing
my first one.

This is why I like playing paper magic: false poker faces.

[rage_jl]

You can keep them spooked just by making sure you 1R open every play from turn 5 on. They'll Rev for less just to keep the counter open and you never have to draw one to keep them at bay. I've played a couple online today where they assume I'm playing with more critters and let me burn them out before they have a chance to reasonably respond. That part will not last but it's working great at the moment.

[Redzone]

Since we're decently in black now, have slaughter games/rakdos returned been considered? I could see myself cutting 1-2 t/ts for either of those cards

[RedNihilist]

Slaughter Games is not where you want to be with this deck, imho.
Rakdos Return is sorcery speed so can be pretty clunky...

[Redzone]

So is t/t though.

[magicdownunder]

Depends on what your trying to beat, RR is much better then T//T vs Mirror - T//T is better vs Control (since RR getting countered is very high).

Running 3/1 split actually sounds decent (though your not doing yourself any favors vs Burn with 8 shocks lands).

[Toddington]

Just because some builds have started running a few Black lands, I don't think that's a green light to go throwing in Black cards willy-nilly.

Toil // Trouble isn't a Black card, you'll never be unable to cast it because you didn't draw one of your 4 - 8 Black sources.

[cloudscraper]

Regarding the "people can't play properly against Toil / Trouble": I've noticed that when they see Blood Crypts they start to think about the card, but they mostly assume it is a sideboard option and play accordingly only post board...

In games 2 and 3 they never rev on their turn, but i've baited more than one control player into revving on his EOT in game ones.

I guess maindeck T/T is still not industry standard.

[Kaitscralt]

Blood Crypt makes people scared of Rakdos Return

[Airdraken]

http://mythicspoiler.com/nyx/cards/kera ... storms.jpg

Worth putting in some temple of enlightenment, and running this?
i was thinking about keranos previously and was hoping it'd be a little better but just wanted your opinions on this?

[zemanjaski]

I will probably test RWu now.

[JohnnyfnB]

http://mythicspoiler.com/nyx/cards/kera ... storms.jpg

Worth putting in some temple of enlightenment, and running this?
i was thinking about keranos previously and was hoping it'd be a little better but just wanted your opinions on this?

I was hoping that the Boros God would have a power like that. Iroas abilities are awesome though for creature builds, very powerful. I am glad we do have this for control match ups, but we were pretty good already http://www.mythicspoiler.com/nyx/cards/ ... ngods.html

I hope we get a really good cheap creature and another really good burn spell, but I might be dreaming a little too much.

[JohnnyfnB]

I loathe Blue, but I completely agree with you Zem. That dude is a badass! He is perfect for a burn deck. Draw a card or free Lightning Strike.

[Airdraken]

if we are running say temple of enlightenment, is a turn//burn with running. i was thinking about it previously and thought it wasnt too good. but now that theres potential to run the god anyway? would you guys consider it?

[JohnnyfnB]

Turn/Burn answers Obzedat, Blood Baron, Gods (which are active), Fiendslayer Paladin, Pack Rat, Master of Waves and turns a huge fatty into something very killable. I still hate blue.

[Airdraken]

haha i'm an izzet player at heart ^^, been waiting for this god haha

[JohnnyfnB]

The only thing is Keranos doesn't give you value until turn 6. He might be one of those, "Good from afar girls, but when you get close up, she's far from good." No offense to any women in this thread. A better card is Dictate of the Twin Gods, which you can flash in on turn 5 and turn 6 your Lightning Strikes do 6 dmg and your Boros Charms do 8 dmg. They both clearly need serious testing first.

[Airdraken]

yeah i totally agree with that point. Would it be fair to compare keranos to chandra? both give card draw or a nuke per turn, however its harder to remove keranos. Although phoenix doesnt trigger off keranos compared to chandra, we cant really activate keranos so were only using him as an enchantment.

[Purp]

Twin Gods seems cool at first glance, but there is a reason we dont play Pyromancers Gauntlet now. We will have to see if and how the format warps.

[JohnnyfnB]

Chandra drops on 4 and can be used on 4. Keranos drops on 5 and can be used on 6. So, to me you lose a whole turn. Yes, it's much harder to destroy Keranos, but I think that card is more for American Control or some daring Izzet player. The more I look at the card and other available options, I think it was a knee jerk reaction to it's ability. Again, I could be completely wrong and testing might prove it's a beast, but I doubt that. We will just have to see.

[Tyrael]

I think people will figure out something crazy with Niv-Mizzet and Keranos but I doubt he'll see any tier 1 play.

[JohnnyfnB]

Twin Gods seems cool at first glance, but there is a reason we dont play Pyromancers Gauntlet now. We will have to see if and how the format warps.

Agreed. The only differences that make it better than PG is it's flash mechanic and it actually doubles damage instead of adding 2. That's huge.

[BlakLanner]

I have already begun working on a deck with Ral Zarek and Keranos. Those cards are just seem too good to not exploit.

[Airdraken]

Chandra drops on 4 and can be used on 4. Keranos drops on 5 and can be used on 6. So, to me you lose a whole turn. Yes, it's much harder to destroy Keranos, but I think that card is more for American Control or some daring Izzet player. The more I look at the card and other available options, I think it was a knee jerk reaction to it's ability. Again, I could be completely wrong and testing might prove it's a beast, but I doubt that. We will just have to see.

Chandra drops on turn 4, but you're only generally using her +1 when you drop her, which is only 1 damage, sure you get the "cant block" mechanic too. but phoenix has evasion as it is. then she does need to survive.

I do see your point though. I agree that perhaps its
more for izzet control as the card gets more powerful the longer the game goes on. only time will tell.

[Airdraken]

I have already begun working on a deck with Ral Zarek and Keranos. Those cards are just seem too good to not exploit.

Ral just seems so weak as a plainswalker, especially his +1, would be interested to see what your brainstorming, just waiting on new cards to come out

[BlakLanner]

I used him to great effect last season in a UWR tempo/burn deck. He might not be what I want this time around since we have Chandra but I want to at least give it a try. I will flesh out the deck more as spoiler season continues.

[Valdarith]

I have already begun working on a deck with Ral Zarek and Keranos. Those cards are just seem too good to not exploit.

Ral just seems so weak as a plainswalker, especially his +1, would be interested to see what your brainstorming, just waiting on new cards to come out

Ral plays well with Inspired guys and Nykthos, plus tapping down a blocker is effectively the same thing as Chandra's +1. He will be exploited eventually but probably not in a tier one deck.

[Kaitscralt]

Ral Zarek belongs in Cube and other formats with broken artifacts.

[Kaitscralt]

I will probably test RWu now.

How can you say this when you won't even test Stormbreath? There's no way Keranos does anything but severely hinder this burn strategy.

[BurnItAllClean]

I will probably test RWu now.

How can you say this when you won't even test Stormbreath? There's no way Keranos does anything but severely hinder this burn strategy.

Keranos could provide extra gas when we need it most. It's worth a test at least. Stormbreath isn't indestructible, doesn't provide any card advantage, and isn't new and shiny.

[Toddington]

Assemble the Legion is a thing, so we know clunky 5-drops can work in the right matchups.

I'd be interested to see what this deck looks like with Blue, I'm not convinced it's worth it though.

[Kaitscralt]

I will probably test RWu now.

How can you say this when you won't even test Stormbreath? There's no way Keranos does anything but severely hinder this burn strategy.

Keranos could provide extra gas when we need it most. It's worth a test at least. Stormbreath isn't indestructible, doesn't provide any card advantage, and isn't new and shiny.

Of course the cards aren't comparable in many ways. But
if you won't play the best five drop for your deck because your deck doesn't need it, why would you play an off-color do nothing?

[BlakLanner]

I used him to great effect last season in a UWR tempo/burn deck. He might not be what I want this time around since we have Chandra but I want to at least give it a try. I will flesh out the deck more as spoiler season continues.

All praise @BasicMountain! He just built a shell that I can work with shell for me. Needs more YP though.
http://www.starcitygames.com/article/28 ... torms.html


Now back to our discussion of the existing format and how we may reduce our opponents to ash.

[Staind Diablo]

I tend to agree Kait. Keranos has a sweet ability, and I am sure there are games where playing him turn 5 means you win turn 6 or 7. But, I think screwing with the mana base which is already a little finicky (to me anyway) to play a 5 drop who does nothing on the turn he is played is not where you want to be with this deck. He will never be active and the ability seems too slow. I won't shoot down the testing of a card, but I don't think Keranos is going to work well in this deck.

[HK1997]

I see it is a very handsome card and if you have it in play, I'm sure it can do a lot of work... But If people are considering a two-color-five-drop that does it's first thing on turn 6... why not consider Mogis God of Slaughter? He comes down on turn 4, has black, which we are already (mostly) fixed for anyways, he does either 2 dmg or removes an opponents creature the second you pass the turn. So it is half a turn faster and gives our opponent a choice between bad and worse. And in most cases, we should have burned out any sacable creatures anyways, giving a reliable source of 2 dmg per turn....

So under the circumstance that people want to play keranos, isnt mogis just the better option?
One gives card advantage or burns for 3
The other kills a creature or burns for 2 and is "on-color" for us. If I was considering bringing in a God, surely it must be Mogis in favor of Keranos?

EDIT:
oops. Mogis is a 4 drop even...

[zenbitz]

There is a thread on DtR that seems more appropriate: viewtopic.php?f=107&t=1675 Keranos seems more like a counterburn/control card to me.... although I would not be opposed to Ypeezy.

[JohnnyfnB]

I see it is a very handsome card and if you have it in play, I'm sure it can do a lot of work... But If people are considering a two-color-five-drop that does it's first thing on turn 6... why not consider Mogis God of Slaughter? He comes down on turn 4, has black, which we are already (mostly) fixed for anyways, he does either 2 dmg or removes an opponents creature the second you pass the turn. So it is half a turn faster and gives our opponent a choice between bad and worse. And in most cases, we should have burned out any sacable creatures anyways, giving a reliable source of 2 dmg per turn....

So under the circumstance that people want to play keranos, isnt mogis just the better option?
One gives card advantage or burns for 3
The other kills a creature or
burns for 2 and is "on-color" for us. If I was considering bringing in a God, surely it must be Mogis in favor of Keranos?

EDIT: oops. Mogis is a 4 drop even...

Yes mogis would be better, but even better then him would be purphoros (especially with YP) or even iroas, but that's a different deck all together.