Fire and Ice Mafia - Game Over!

[rcwraspy]

GR, can you explain your thumbs up on Fate, please?

It means that I have him on my probtown list, based on his early posts. Still pending re-read.

Sorry, yes, I know what it means. I was hoping to prompt a reason for him being on your protown list. What specifically did you like about his early posts? I'm assuming those were the ones where he basically said he was scum?

[imopen2]

imopen, you didn't answer my question.

My eyes skippe over it cause I assumed it was a sig.

I believe at that point I was still trying to explain my actions to wraith? It seems clear, now that manders and you have come to my defense, that I will not be lynched toDay.

[Jack]

Freedom, have you given up?

Nope. I had given up when I thought I was a for-sure lynch and I'd be pretty busy with other stuff, but now it looks like you're picking on other people and I'll have plenty of time for the game.

You're beginning to post because the pressure is not on you as much. This should be our lynch for toDay because of this one post. I would be very surprised if freedom flipped Town after this
post.

I was away from the game for a few days last week because I was at L-2 and had two people willing to vote for me once they wrapped their head around some shit and got to ask a few more questions, so I decided to ignore the game so that I could focus a bit more on other stuff. Now that there seems to be multiple potential endings for the Day, I'm much more inclined to participate.

I haven't done much lately because I was a bit busy and the thread wasn't too active beyond your bickering with Wraith.
I've lost some confidence in a few of my readers, but:
-zem is still scum
-I'm seeing imopen2 to be a lot scummier than I had previously viewed him to be. Null
-I would like to see Murphy lynched
-Wraith is probably town.
-Fate might be scum. 50-50.
-raspy hasn't done anything scummy, so he's probably town.
-
Manders is null, lean town.

A few posts later and you now saying you weren't posting because of a bicker between players and because you were busy. Nothing to do with the fact that you were close to lynch (and thought you would be the lynch).

We should be lynching freedom at this point. Anyone not voting freedom needs to give their reasoning on why they are not.[/quote]
That was why I wasn't posting much on Saturday or Sunday. The game was stale, and I'm not really one to lead a scum hunt.

[zemanjaski]

If you're Town, why give up scum hunting, even if you'll get lynched? It still helps Town for you to contribute. You came to that exact conclusion yourself in DTR mafia - that contributing more is the best thing that you can do for Town. Now here, instead, you're retreating back into your shell? You know from our discussions in DTR that we can lose Townies if enough info comes from it; yet you're only now willing to provide content because it looks like you might not be lynched?

Please explain how your course of action helped Town.

[Jack]

-snip-
So to boil this down, you're hounding imopen for defending Freedom and not wanting to vote him.

And then you're defending Freedom and not wanting to vote him.

THIS is a contradiction. Care to explain?

Sure!
I need to
flesh out my opinions and I think it is boiling down to freedom is scum to me. Freedom posts crap and defends scum posts with ridiculous stupidity.
By "scum posts," do you mean my own posts or Murphy's posts?
I just don't get it. He has a record in DTR mafia on doing that. Maybe if We votes his ass; he will quit that shit.

1) Care to bring up examples? I don't need direct quotes, just some situations where I acted similarly.
2) I was already at L-2 once. Did I seem to quit? I know I acted differently once I found myself with a significant number of votes, what do you think of my change in behavior and apparent mindset?(not a rhetorical question; please answer)
I never said I would not vote Freedom, and will if a vote on Iamopen2 fails. Thus it's not a contradiction, but I am perplexed on Freedom's posts. I have not deviated from my opinion on Iamopen2 and am still willing to vote C.M. and/or Freedom. They
are my strongest scum team as of now.
Wait, me and Murphy are on the same team now? When did you come to this conclusion? I wasn't defending Murphy when I was "playing devil's advocate;" simply stating that we should keep an open mind, rather than saying "one pro-scum post = 100% scum, lynch now without further analysis."
You could read my evaluation as a contradiction if you wanted to, but THREE great scum targets are before us and I can only choose ONE this day. Booooooo, not cool! My choice is still Iamopen2 if I can get more support, but the other 2 are just as good.
At no point in this game did I approve of freedom or defend his action, but offered past intelligence from DTR mafia for my doubts which causes the conundrum I find. Does that make sense?

questions/responses in blue

And yes, this post makes sense. While I disagree with a lot of your reasoning, at least I can see where
you're coming from here.

[Jack]

[quote="[url=viewtopic.php?p=179820#p179820:18zmv8v3]zemanjaski » Mon Jan 27, 2014 4:44 pm[/url:18zmv8v3]":18zmv8v3]If you're Town, why give up scum hunting, even if you'll get lynched? It still helps Town for you to contribute. You came to that exact conclusion yourself in DTR mafia - that contributing more is the best thing that you can do for Town. Now here, instead, you're retreating back into your shell? You know from our discussions in DTR that we can lose Townies if enough info comes from it; yet you're only now willing to provide content because it looks like you might not be lynched?

Please explain how your course of action helped Town.[/quote:18zmv8v3]
I wasn't being too helpful by not posting. Sometimes, though, I don't know what to say to start up a discussion, so I mostly just respond to other posts.

[zemanjaski]

So now that you might not be lynched, you know what to say?

[( G_R )]

GR, can you explain your thumbs up on Fate, please?

It means that I have him on my probtown list, based on his early posts. Still pending re-read.

Sorry, yes, I know what it means. I was hoping to prompt a reason for him being on your protown list. What specifically did you like about his early posts? I'm assuming those were the ones where he basically said he was scum?

Based on the last time I
played with him, and that thing he does where he's supposed to be a Mafia celebrity but here his meta is not as relevant, but I kinda believe him. It's a gut feeling, mostly.

[imopen2]

I'm not sure if that's a great reason to believe he is town. Seems like a lazy way to avoid playing mafia the hard way, instead attempting to make people sheep him without reasoning.

[Link]

guys ^this is scum I had faith itd be dead by the time I came back

[imopen2]

guys ^this is scum I had faith itd be dead by the time I came back

If anything, you are proving your ineptitude with comments like this. I am town and if you did some work to read the thread you would know this.

[Wraith223]

-snip-
So to boil this down, you're hounding imopen for defending Freedom and not wanting
to vote him.

And then you're defending Freedom and not wanting to vote him.

THIS is a contradiction. Care to explain?

Sure!
I need to flesh out my opinions and I think it is boiling down to freedom is scum to me. Freedom posts crap and defends scum posts with ridiculous stupidity.
By "scum posts," do you mean my own posts or Murphy's posts?
Mainly just Captain Murphy's post that started this mess or whale we are trying to land. Still sifting out the biggest whale.
I just don't get it. He has a record in DTR mafia on doing that. Maybe if We votes his ass; he will quit that shit.

1) Care to bring up examples? I don't need direct quotes, just some situations where I acted similarly. You were afraid of real town lynching you in post 86, you try sarcasm in game of mafia that post by calling yourself scum in post 105, in
late game (post 1005) you were right about zem not being scum but said we extracted some information but failed to say what it was, and you again you defended the top target we thought was scum. This where I get confused. You say weird shit, but end up being right in DTR. Thus I am in a conundrum. Now to the this discussion here on DTR, it does nothing really for this game, thus prefer to stay in this game as you REALLY could be scum. I am not afraid of asking others for an opinion on you as I find my opinion of you tainted from DTR game play.
2) I was already at L-2 once. Did I seem to quit? Yes, and you became really reactive, but timid. I know I acted differently once I found myself with a significant number of votes, what do you think of my change in behavior and apparent mindset?(not a rhetorical question; please answer)[/color] You are trying, but again, has your opinions allowing the discussion of the possibility of
hearing out Captain Murphy on Doc Hunting helped town? Your mindset is defensive but passive. You answer questions, but don't throw the ball in Captain Murphy's court demanding answers why what he said is good for town. You only answer give answers to your "devils advocate claim" as a lawyer would. This is mafia, not court. Don't defend another unless you have evidence to the opposite for which Captain Murphy has sat there and done nothing but let YOU stew.
I never said I would not vote Freedom, and will if a vote on Iamopen2 fails. Thus it's not a contradiction, but I am perplexed on Freedom's posts. I have not deviated from my opinion on Iamopen2 and am still willing to vote C.M. and/or Freedom. They are my strongest scum team as of now.
Wait, me and Murphy are on the same team now? When did you come to this conclusion? I wasn't defending Murphy when I was "playing devil's advocate;" simply stating that we should keep an open mind,
rather than saying "one pro-scum post = 100% scum, lynch now without further analysis." By allowing an open mind to finding our safety roles; we allow for them to be put at risk, thus an inverse relation of scum is found. It is still defending a bad call.
You could read my evaluation as a contradiction if you wanted to, but THREE great scum targets are before us and I can only choose ONE this day. Booooooo, not cool! My choice is still Iamopen2 if I can get more support, but the other 2 are just as good.
At no point in this game did I approve of freedom or defend his action, but offered past intelligence from DTR mafia for my doubts which causes the conundrum I find. Does that make sense?

questions/responses in blue

And yes, this post makes sense. While I disagree with a lot of your reasoning, at least I can see where you're coming from here.

The color
separation is getting hard to work with, thus it looks weird. My fault for trying to add color seperation and don't have time to fix it.

[Link]

Imopen what do you think about void?

[Captain Murphy]

I've been busy with the long weekend and work, will catch up later with a nice big manders/wraith style post

[imopen2]

Imopen what do you think about void?

I would like to thank you for asking this question, since it caused me to isolate void's posts (there are only 16) and decide to build this case against him:

In my mind I had void as null, leaning town, from what I could remember of his posts. Once I isolated his posts, however, I found some disturbing things.

His posts can be found here: http://diestoremoval.com/search.php?t=2 ... uthor=void


After an RVS vote and some minor questions, Void casts his first real "vote"

[b:
9yjssgh2]@freedom:[/b]
Thank you for that info. Also, the statement about Town posting badly or however you phrased it does make you look bad because it sounds like you are Scum trying to act as Town and for that reason you have earned my vote for now as well.

Vote: freedom

---

If freedom flips Town, then fate is likely to be Scum after those postings.

here he is kinda just summarizing people's previous arguments and laying down a vote (the fourth vote on Freedom). this is the kind of behavior that looks town until you look at it in context with his other posts.

like this one (bolded for emphasis):

@Wraith:
If you want to take that route, then you need to look at the first time you told me to "eat dick". I'm not going to come down to your low anymore. It serves no purpose other than trying to get a reaction out of someone.

That is good to hear. I was just messin with you. It would be nice to get a read from you on Iamopen2, freedom, Stardust, Me, and Zem. A simple summary of why each of us are town, null, or scum would be great. That's alot to ask but we have not really heard from you and other being silent. Feel free to ask me questions.

I'm not going to do a bunch of busy work. I have been stating who I want to lynch and have been asking questions to others as I see appropriate.

This is also Day 1. I'm not looking to chain lynches or looking the Scum buddy of a
potentially found Scum member. I will have stronger reads come Day 2 and I will give you an answer to this question then.

up until this point Void had literally one post where he mentioned who he wanted to lynch, and it was the post where he voted freedom. it is actually the only post he has had with actual content. yes, many of his posts include questions that could come from a town mindset, but he hasn't answered anything really.

in the above post he says he doesn't want busy work in order to avoid giving reads, for a couple posts he compares Stardust to someone else entirely to give a reason for suspecting Stardust, he discusses the merits of townslips in this type of game for somewhat bullshit reasons (scum are hunting scum so they can make town slips? if the game were more basic he could see it being important? this doesn't make sense to me since my "townslip" would not have applied in either of these cases), he spends two posts voting and unvoting wraith by "
townslipping" in the exact same matter that people felt applied to my mindset. it feels somewhat forced to me.

anyways, so we've got 1 real vote, a lot of simple question or minor corrections on other people's theory/logic, ~2 posts about a mixup, ~3 posts about townslips, 2 posts with his own "townslip" vote/unvote...plus RVS...basically ~50-60%% of his 16 posts have been filler.

I'm going to

Unvote

and

Vote Void

[imopen2]

@Wraith:
If you want to take that route, then you need to look at the first time you told me to "eat dick". I'm not going to come down to your low anymore. It serves no purpose other than trying to get a reaction out of someone.

That is good to hear. I was just messin with you. It would be nice to get a read from you on Iamopen2, freedom, Stardust, Me, and Zem. A simple summary of why each of us are
town, null, or scum would be great. That's alot to ask but we have not really heard from you and other being silent. Feel free to ask me questions.

I'm not going to do a bunch of busy work. I have been stating who I want to lynch and have been asking questions to others as I see appropriate.

This is also Day 1. I'm not looking to chain lynches or looking the Scum buddy of a potentially found Scum member. I will have stronger reads come Day 2 and I will give you an answer to this question then.

Somehow my bolding didn't stick. it is corrected above.

[Manders]

Freedom, have you given up?

Nope. I had given up when I thought I was a for-sure lynch and I'd be pretty busy with other stuff, but now it looks like you're picking on other people and I'll have plenty of time for the game.

You're beginning to post because the pressure is not on you as much. This should be our lynch for toDay because of this one post. I would be very surprised if freedom flipped Town after this
post.

I haven't done much lately because I was a bit busy and the thread wasn't too active beyond your bickering with Wraith.
I've lost some confidence in a few of my readers, but:
-zem is still scum
-I'm seeing imopen2 to be a lot scummier than I had previously viewed him to be. Null
-I would like to see Murphy lynched
-Wraith is probably town.
-Fate might be scum. 50-50.
-raspy hasn't done anything scummy, so he's probably town.
-Manders is null, lean town.

A few posts later and you now saying you weren't posting because of a bicker between players and because you were busy. Nothing to do with the fact that you were close to lynch (and thought you would be the lynch).

We should be lynching freedom at this point. Anyone not voting freedom needs to give their reasoning on why they are not.

nAgreed.

[Stardust]

Yo, Z, 'sup? Are we lynching you or freedom today?

[DroppinSuga]

I'm pulling my scum move for the game.

I'm just going to pop in and

unvote
vote zemanjaski

Let's lynch this obvi-scum and be done with it. I thought we were going to lynch imopen but people are being flaky. Let's lynch Z and move the fuck on.

[rcwraspy]

reasons? case?

[Wraith223]

I'm pulling my scum move for the game.

I'm just going to pop in and

unvote
vote zemanjaski

Let's lynch this obvi-scum and be done with it. I thought we were going to lynch imopen but people are being flaky. Let's lynch Z and move the fuck on.

Can we get your analysis of why Zem should be lynched? According to the past posts among others, Freedom is the "obvi-scum". You wanted to talk about it more now you want to "move the fuck on"? Where was your discussion? Lastly, why would you say "scum move"?

[imopen2]

So no one likes my case? I was high when I wrote it but I still put some solid effort into it...whatever, I guess it will have to wait for day 2

[Stardust]

Yeah.

[( G_R )]

Suga is scum.

Vote DroppinSuga

[Stardust]

I doubt it. He's actually among my strongest town reads.

"I'm pulling my scum move for the game"... Really? Is this something a scum player says? Blah, blah, WIFOM, but seriously now.

[Kazekirimaru]

Vote Count 11!
Those goalposts have legs

Stardust (0)
freedom (4) - Captain Murphy, Void, Manders, rcwraspy
rcwraspy (0)
zemanjaski (2) - freedom, DroppinSuga
Void (1) - imopen2
Wraith223 (0)
Fate (0)
Captain Murphy (0)
DroppinSuga (1) - (G_R)
Manders (0)
rezombad (0)
(G_R) (0)
imopen2 (3) - Wraith223, zemanjaski, Fate

Not Voting (2) - rezombad, Stardust

With 13 alive, it is 7 to lynch.

Deadline is: 30 January, 2014 11:59PM EST

[zemanjaski]

Yo, Z, 'sup? Are we lynching you or freedom today?

Freedom or imopen2. Ill know when ive caught up. Submitting my second article soon then ill be addressing the last few pages.

[( G_R )]

I doubt it. He's actually among my strongest town reads.

"I'm pulling my scum move for the game"... Really? Is this something a scum player says? Blah, blah, WIFOM, but seriously now.

That's exactly it. He's creating a WIFOM situation. That's as scummy as it gets.

[zemanjaski]

@ Manders, having played with imopen2, his style of posting so far is consistent with his scum game. I am content with my vote remaining here for now.

Have you ever played with him as town?

Yes, Ragnarok Mafia (viewtopic.php?f=111&t=1970) where we were both Town.

Noob though I may be, I am more confidant about imopen2 than freedom.

Since when and why?

At the time, Freedom's last few posts had come off as sincere, and he had acknowledged trying to "act as Town" deliberately (something you yourself had commented on). The content of those posts gave me some small measure of uncertainty, and that imopen2 then continued with his argument that "freedom had done nothing scummy whatsoever", in the face of multiple players saying that "yes, freedom had done scummy things" and freedom himself admitting that he had tried to act Town (which is typically an indicator of scum) was sufficient to move imopen2 to the top of my suspect list.

I can try to elaborate tonight if I have time re: Zem but off te top of my head...

He is being aggressive as normal (as of yet I haven't played a game with him where he was scum, likewise I believe this is the first game I've been town that involved Zem).

HOWEVER, usually his agression is based on (IMO) legit reasoning. His case on freedom was terrible and was based on freedom saying that CM might have worded something poorly, just as he felt he had.

He then went nuts on freedom with no further analysis, he just kept saying "lynch lynch, can we lynch? Lets lynch!"

He seemed in a huge hurry to lynch freedom over something that didn't sit right to me so I said as much.

We were both Town in Ragnarok. Its amazing that you continue to say that my case on freedom is based on nothing. Its like you don't read my posts at all. Or the posts by other players. Or freedom admitting that he was trying to act Town...

Aside: there was a lot of
discussion on "scumslips", regarding imopen2 forgetting that there are two scum factions. Given he has stated more than once that he isn't invested in this game, I cannot put any value in the slip, either way, he probably just wasn't paying close attention to the format. I don't think that is an indicator of alignment.
Aside: Suga needs to contribute, for example, that case on me that he promised on the 24th (and was asked for again by myself, stardust and imopen2).
Aside: Wraith needs to stop with the crap gifs from crap shows

Freedom, have you given up?

Nope. I had given up when I thought I was a for-sure lynch and I'd be pretty busy with other stuff, but
now it looks like you're picking on other people and I'll have plenty of time for the game.

This is insanely scummy. Town wouldn't give up if they were going to be a mislynch, they would still keep actively generating information that would be of use for Town. Mafia have no reason to do that, since their Mafia buddy doesn't need the info. This is a major scum slip.

Unvote

Alright, a re-read is in order. Right now this is my stance on each player:

1. Stardust
2. freedom
3. rcwraspy
4. zemanjaski

5. Void
6. Wraith223
7. Fate
8. Captain Murphy
9. DroppinSuga
10. Manders
11. rezombad
12. (G_R)
13. imopen2

Fate and Void getting smilies is particularly strange.

Aside: I really did like imopen2's analysis of Void. Thanks.

I'm pulling my scum move for the game.

I'm just going to pop in and

unvote
vote zemanjaski

Let's lynch this obvi-scum and be done with it. I thought we were going to lynch imopen but people are being flaky. Let's lynch Z and move the fuck on.

- Doesn't post promised case
- Wants to slow the game down and have discussion
- Calls for a quick lynch

Not sure if Scum or stupid (both?).

I just read 200 messages so my brain is fried, but this is most of what stuck out to me. Freedom
is back to being the number 1 scumspect after I read that quoted passage. It makes me doubt the sincerity of his "I made all those obvious efforts to look Town because I am noobTown!" much more questionable. More likely it was a clever way of explaining away his behavior as scum (Occam's Razor applies). He also promised more activity and hasn't delivered on that either.

Other notes:
- Void moves to scumspect
- G_R still null
- Manders to probTown
- Rezombad needs to post more
- Wraith still looks Town to me

Unvote, vote Freedom

[zemanjaski]

Oh, i've also come around to liking raspy as Town.

[Stardust]

We were both Town in Ragnarok. Its amazing that you continue to say that my case on freedom is based on nothing. Its like you don't read my posts at all. Or the posts by other players. Or freedom admitting that he was trying to act Town...

Was (or is) your case on freedom based on anything other than the fact that he was trying to act town?

[zemanjaski]

How do you do the search function thing SD? I want to look up some specific posts to get wording correct in my head.

[Stardust]

http://diestoremoval.com/search.php?t=2 ... or=freedom

[zemanjaski]

Thanks.

The narrative of my case for Freedom is as follows:
- I like Freedom for Town early, because of his increased activity and the thoughtfulness of his posts. Its his second game, but his early posts are consistent with his growing Town game in DTR Mafia.

viewtopic.php?p=176196#p176196
This is the first post that catches my attention. As I commented at the time, I didn't like his "he's probably just Town saying the wrong things, like I am" suggestion. It just strikes me as so forced - there is no need for Freedom to include the additional "like me!" at the end; effectively all it adds is that Freedom has a reasonable excuse if he gets caught in a scumslip later.

viewtopic.php?p=176293#p176293
This T/S list is concerning. He puts the player who was defending him in the Town pile, with no suspicion; and the player that is challenging him immediately into his scum pile. This reeks of OMGUS. When I was noob town I never assumed that someone voting for me or asking me questions must be scum as Freedom does here. Freedom immediately accepts imopen2 as Town on the basis that imopen2 is defending him, which doesn't make much sense. It isn't like scum can buddy Town for towncred or anything...

viewtopic.php?p=176429#p176429
viewtopic.php?p=176430#p176430
viewtopic.php?p=176430#p176431
Notice that
all of these posts come in a couple of minutes, which suggests stream of consciousness thinking. Usually, that is pretty truthful. The first two posts lean Town to me, but the third one reeks of scum. Clearly implying "I am playing like that other game where I was Town, so I am Town here" is a strong indicator of scum imo.

viewtopic.php?p=176433#p176433
Instead of calmly explaining away my case, Freedom engages in handwaving. To me, this indicates an inability to explain his behavior; if it were easy to suggest Town logic, he would just do so and move on. It is especially damning that he doesn't acknowledge that "trying to act Town" is what scum do, or that many other posts are voting for him

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2234&p=176700#p176700
OMGUS vote. He engages in WIFOM soon after creating the "either zem or I am scum" scenario. That pushed me back towards thinking he was Town (I moved my vote to imopen2 at around this time) because that sort of strategic line really only benefits Town.

I'm not going to deny this. I thought it was a good move. I guess I shouldn't try to look town, since people think that that makes me look scummy. Lesson learned.

Just putting this here so that there is no doubt, Freedom admitted to deliberately posting in such a way as to look Town.

viewtopic.php?p=176792#p176792
viewtopic.php?p=176793#p176793

These two posts, within a minute of each other, read to me as a forced Townslip. There's just no way, following what Freedom said in the first post that anyone could accidentally arrive at the conclusion that both scum teams have day chat, so that he suggests they do really seems like an obvious effort to look Town.

Looks like I may have just lost the game. Sorry!

-edit-


Murphy, now is probably your best chance to look for doc choices, if you're still into that sort of thing.

This read to me as being defeated scum, since Town certainly do not lose if a VT gets lynched early, especially in this format. This marks the start of Freedom reducing his output to the minimum
since he thinks he will be lynched, which isn't a Town-minded thing to do. Note also that he encourages Murphy to return to the doc target discussion, which was decided could benefit scum. Freedom either does this to help identify targets for his scum buddy, or to get Murphy to actually draw huge attention to himself. Both lines are scummy.

viewtopic.php?p=179572#p179572
As soon as he might not be the lynch, suddenly he is re-engaged with the game?

In summary:
- admits to making forced Townslips. Its more likely this is scum behaviour than Town behaviour.
- OMGU-y behaviour
- Hasn't actually made an effort to hunt scum; only to suggest that I must be scum for going after him.
- Stopped posting and acted defeated when pressure mounted, only to be re-engaged when it looked like he might get off.

[Jack]

Good case! I might have actually believed this if Kaze didn't tell me otherwise. However, I feel the need to defend myself here so that others may see that you are wrong.

viewtopic.php?p=176293#p176293
This T/S list is concerning. He puts the player who was defending him in the Town pile, with no suspicion; and the player that is challenging him immediately into his scum pile. This reeks of OMGUS. When I was noob town I never assumed that someone voting for me or asking me questions must be scum as Freedom does here. Freedom immediately accepts imopen2 as Town on the basis that imopen2 is defending him, which doesn't make much sense. It isn't like scum can buddy Town for towncred or anything...

I posted that list mostly just to start some discussion. As I'm seeing now, it was illogical of me to put imopen in the town pile just because he was saying the things I wanted to
hear. I did think of the possibility of him being scum looking for towncred, but still felt that he was more town at that point.

viewtopic.php?p=176429#p176429
viewtopic.php?p=176430#p176430
viewtopic.php?p=176430#p176431
Notice that all of these posts come in a couple of minutes, which suggests stream of consciousness thinking. Usually, that is pretty truthful. The first two posts lean Town to me, but the third one reeks of scum. Clearly implying "I am playing like that other game where I was Town, so I am Town here" is a strong indicator of scum imo.

I think I've already mentioned this, but that third post wasn't really about what I did in those two scenarios; just the scenarios themselves. I was implying that the last time you made accusations based upon similar logic, you were wrong.

freedom » Tue Jan 21, 2014 9:35 am wrote:

Looks like I may have just lost the game. Sorry!

-edit-


Murphy, now is probably your best chance to look for doc choices, if you're still into that sort of thing.

This read to me as being defeated scum, since Town certainly do not lose if a VT gets lynched early, especially in this format. This marks the start of Freedom reducing his output to the minimum since he thinks he will be lynched, which isn't a Town-minded thing to do. Note also that he encourages Murphy to return to the doc target discussion, which was decided could benefit scum. Freedom either does this to help identify targets for his scum buddy, or to get Murphy to actually draw huge attention to himself. Both lines are scummy.

I thought it was somewhat fitting to say that I may have lost the game, since I, personally, had failed because of my mistakes, and thus would probably be unable to play anymore. I didn't mean that I had lost the game for my team. In fact, come to think of it, if you
guys are going to myslynch, I'm probably your best option in terms of possible information to be gained. Still, I advise that you look towards another player, since, as zem had previously pointed out, the town suffers greatly from killing a townie Day one due to a high probability of losing two more players in the Night.

The part about Murphy was partially just me making fun of his idea and partially a reminder to the other players to not forget about what he had said earlier.

[zemanjaski]

Good case! I might have actually believed this if Kaze didn't tell me otherwise. However, I feel the need to defend myself here so that others may see that you are wrong.

This just sounds too awkward.

[Link]

you guys sure do put shit tons of effort into this

at least I found out Imopen and Void are on different scumteams (if G_R is scum after all this time Imma be mad)

[zemanjaski]

Alright Fate, level with us. Make cases for those players.

[Link]

see now Z, I need you to read between the lines.

"you guys sure put lots of effort n shit" isn't going to transition into me making super long cases on people.

I mean

does this game really need more of that at this time? be honest

[Link]

but sure freedom is still fine

Unvote:
Vote: freedom